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Topic: Game analysis (Read 2257 times) |
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Isaac Grosof
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Game analysis
« on: Dec 13th, 2009, 8:30pm » |
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On this thread, people can submit game they would like to have people analyze, and then a more experienced people can point out what they should work on.
If there is already a place to do this, please point it out.
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Sorry about that one thing.
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omar
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Re: Game analysis
« Reply #2 on: Dec 24th, 2009, 5:51pm » |
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Good idea. Thanks for starting this.
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Isaac Grosof
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Re: Game analysis
« Reply #4 on: Dec 27th, 2009, 9:11pm » |
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I think what happened to you in this game, Scorinbulus, was that you are great at the tactical struggle, but you fall apart in the endgame. As I see it, once you have a material advantage in an Arimaa game, you convert it into a win by creating a goal threat. You ended up with a material advantage, but you didn't attack, so luck worked against you. when you attack, if you get lucky you win. When you defend, if you get lucky you win a rabbit or two. If you attack once you're up, you'll win.
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Sorry about that one thing.
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tize
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Re: Game analysis
« Reply #5 on: Dec 28th, 2009, 4:46am » |
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Up until 31s I think you were doing fine, but allowing him to capture that rabbit and totally emptying your western wing from non-rabbit (and at the same time stoping your goal threat) was the turning point.
Maybe somethinig like 31s rc6w rd5w rf7w re8w or 31s rc6w ra8s Cf5n Cf6x ef4n. I like the first more because the cat can't be saved and the elephant looses a lot of mobility.
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Hippo
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Re: Game analysis
« Reply #6 on: Dec 28th, 2009, 2:56pm » |
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It seems to me
33s de7w re8w dd7w dc7n
would be the last chance of silver.
But surely ... cat could be taken at 31s with horse and step for rabbit leaving the trap would lead to clear win.
on Jan 12th, 2010, 12:47pm, Hippo wrote:I would prefere to give here links to games you want to analyze and analyze them in their own comments. One can go for comments from either the game history or from the forum.
Linking the other direction seems to be worse. |
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Oops ... I had to read the Read before before I have posted that so ... removed...
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| « Last Edit: Jan 12th, 2010, 12:51pm by Hippo » |
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chessandgo
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Re: Game analysis
« Reply #7 on: Jan 10th, 2010, 3:50am » |
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Hey, that's a good idea. Thought I'd get at shot at commenting those 2 games. Where do you think posting the comments is more appropriate, in this thread or in the game comments? I'm going to post here for a start.
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chessandgo
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Re: Game analysis
« Reply #8 on: Jan 10th, 2010, 4:04am » |
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on Dec 27th, 2009, 6:03pm, Sconibulus wrote:
7g gold should withdraw his Dog. Be careful Sconibulus not to let your cat be dragged towards the opponent's side in the opening (having a horse get dragged is no problem by comparison, so your 4s/5s combo is somewhat bad)
12s don't let gold exchange his hostaged M for your m.
15s no, defending your d5 dog was more pressing, on 17g gold could capture your dog and play Rc6ee to defend the Hg6.
28s at this stage (and even much earlier) you should not be dragging enemy pieces towards your side, but invading the enemy side to capture in his traps. Your elephant will follow his Elephant to prevent him from capturing your attacking pieces, and as you have the two strongest pieces (horses), you will be able to capture in the other trap and quickly goal (I mean cg5->g3, hg6->f2/e3 for example, and if the two elephants come around f3, then hb6->b3 and dc7-> c2 for example).
30s capture the Cf4
31s capture the Cf5
32s you need one piece on the western side, so de7->b7 looks good
33s h e5-> b6 looks good
35s replace the cat step by dd8w (you're still winning)
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chessandgo
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Re: Game analysis
« Reply #9 on: Jan 10th, 2010, 4:29am » |
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on Dec 13th, 2009, 8:32pm, 722caasi wrote:
7s prevent the horse frame (M to b5 hb5w for example, or flip the M to e3)
8s oops, end up on g5 with the h
9g capture the hf4
11g maybe Ec4en rg5w Hg4n is best, making it tough for silver to capture anything.
13g E should end up on d5 rather than e4
13s nice move
15g take the hh4 hostage (not that it's worth a dog, but with MH traded, the h is like a m)
17s - 24s you ended up exchanging hrr for D 722caasi, which is to say you gave up the hh3 for free. Starting from 19s for example, what you want to do is to rotate your phant out of f3 defense: dh6->f5 and dd8->e3 (or even better f2 if gold lets you). With possibly a rabbit involved if you have time. The quickest version (and speed is essential, since gold is going to capture on the west until your elephant comes back into play) takes 11 steps, ie 3 moves. Compare what you would get (free elephant, strongest available piece, f3 control) with the game's 22s.
24s oops
25g capture the cc7
29g don't move away from the west with Rb3, on the contrary you will need a Cat there
31g don't let the Rb3 be captured (ie get a Cat back to western side)
35g you don't need the E in defense, get ready to capture on f6 and goal with the Rh2
38g oops, but the game was still won for gold up to that point.
722caasi, rotating the elephant out of a hostage defense is what you need to work on I think.
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| « Last Edit: Jan 10th, 2010, 4:30am by chessandgo » |
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chessandgo
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Re: Game analysis
« Reply #10 on: Jan 10th, 2010, 12:33pm » |
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ah, I had not realized there was now a forum for game analysis; I've cross-posted in the game comments
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novacat
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Re: Game analysis
« Reply #12 on: Jan 12th, 2010, 5:32am » |
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Game 131485:
722caasi, you played well. Other than a missed free horse on 12s, I only have one comment. When you have the camel hostage, you can attack the f3 trap with your camel and horse. Make sure to keep to the outside so that the opposing E cannot reach you in 1 turn. By pinning the gold camel you tied up your camel and restricted the movement of the opposing E by little more than he already was (he already had to come back to defend every turn).
RBriney, valiant effort. The best way to avoid obvious mistakes is to practice a lot. Here are a few pointers for strategy.
-It is usually considered a bad idea to take a horse with the E when the camel is still in play. There is a section that talks about this in the wiki article about strategy that will elaborate better than myself.
-Once your camel is taken hostage, the best thing to do is blockade the silver E. If you manage to trap him in, you can free your E.
-With the camel pinned in the trap, attacking with the horses was a good move. Unfortunately silver also had two horses there. I suggest going for control of the f6 trap next time. Once the horses are in place, you may even be able to move your E over (losing your camel) and capture enough pieces to push a rabbit through before silver can take advantage of its superior material position.
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epiph
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Arimaa player #5016
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Re: Game analysis
« Reply #13 on: Mar 3rd, 2010, 7:05pm » |
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I'm still getting started at Arimaa and working my way up the bot ladder, and I seem to get flustered when I have less than 2 min allowed per move, so I hope this game proves interesting enough for the experts to comment on:
http://arimaa.com/arimaa/gameroom/comments.cgi?gid=136448
I've left two questions in comments: one tactical/endgame (the ending seems to my eye to be more sharp and interesting than the bot made it) and one strategic/opening.
(I'm planning on ordering Fritzlein's book soon.)
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