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Topic: Arimaa sets (Read 6371 times) |
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omar
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Arimaa sets
« on: Jun 24th, 2008, 11:31am » |
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Every so often I get emails through the contact page from people asking if there are Arimaa sets available that they can buy. The site clearly states that Arimaa was designed so that it could be played using a chess set. Usually these are people who I don't even see in the gameroom regularly. I just explain to them that they can use a chess set and four coins to play it. One person replied back saying he knew that, but just wanted a set as decor on his coffee table  . I found that quite funny.
For a couple years now Karl (Fritzlein) has also been asking me when I'm going to get Arimaa sets made. Of course he knows that it can be played with a chess set (he usually has his most interesting Arimaa postal positions setup on his chess set at home). However his justifications for publishing Arimaa sets made a lot of sense and eventually persuaded me. First he wanted to have the same pieces in a real set that he has become used to online. Also he said it would help legitimatize the game and attract more players to it; players who otherwise might not even consider the game. So maybe then he would have more people to play against when he logs into the gameroom. I couldn't refute that but managed to delay him by saying I'll get sets made if he would write a book about Arimaa . Actually, I didn't think the gameroom or the game client were ready yet for more traffic (I had not even started working on the V2 Flash client at the time); I also wanted to improve the rating system; and make various other improvements to the site. I thought that more players would just put more load on the system and possibly cause crashes and require more support from me; thus I would have even less time to improve the site. Also I like letting Arimaa grow slowly at its own pace without publicizing it too much. But I did assure him that I would eventually get sets made. Karl's wife Katie (Elmo in the gameroom) even did some research to see what it would require to self publish sets and kindly shared it with me. But it looked like it would require a lot of time and effort on my part and I just didn't feel ready for it.
Then about a year ago a game publishing company (Z-man Games http://www.zmangames.com/) contacted me about making Arimaa sets. But I was in the middle of working on the V2 client and the yearly events would be needing my attention soon after that. So I politely asked if I could get back to them in a few months.
Well I'm happy to announce that I finally did get back to them and we now have a written agreement in place to have Arimaa sets made. I can't discuss the details of the agreement, but I can tell you that most likely later this year we might actually see some real sets.
With almost 6 years of continuous play on the Internet and thousands of games played by both computers and humans (with some individuals single handedly playing over a thousand games ), Arimaa will probably be the most play tested game prior to being published. I want to thank everyone (there are way too many people for me to name) who have stuck with Arimaa since its early days and have helped make the game what it is today. You've given me the confidence now to think that Arimaa really is a game that is interesting for people to play. Also I am more confident now then ever before that humans will be able to keep computers at bay for many years to come; and hopefully when the Arimaa challenge is finally won, it really will be due an advancement in software and not just the hardware getting faster.
Even with all that has happened in the Arimaa world so far I think we are still in the early stages of the game and there are lots of interesting things still waiting to happen. Imagine the many interesting challenge matches that are yet to come. Imagine watching the bots improve year to year. Imagine watching the community grow year to year and meeting the many like minded people who have yet to join. Imagine that perhaps the best players of the game aren't even aware of it yet; or maybe they are, but either way the future World championship matches are going to be ever more exciting.
If Arimaa does start to become commercially successful I would like to create a publicly owned company around it so that other can also share in its growth and success. However as long as I have any control over it the bottom line of the company will always be second to the service that it provides to the players and spectators of the game.
Also I am starting to get the feeling that I also need to setup a non-profit organization to ensure the continuity of the games future. I picture this organization being responsible for holding the Arimaa challenge fund and distributing the fund when the challenge is met or has expired. I also picture this organization being the official body that sets the match rules for the World championships and other tournaments. It would also assign official player ratings and titles; along with holding the official games database on which the ratings and titles are based. That database could include games not just from the arimaa.com site, but also other sites. I will write more about this organization in a later post.
I think 2008 is going to be a pivotal year for Arimaa and hopefully the future will be even more fun and exciting for everyone.
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mistre
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Re: Arimaa sets
« Reply #1 on: Jun 24th, 2008, 4:45pm » |
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Wow, this is great news Omar!
I am an aspiring game designer myself - although I have never had a game published. I did have Zman games express interest and look at one of my prototypes. They passed on it, saying it had potential, but needed more work. I have since then been working on improving it and hope to submit to another publisher soon.
Arimaa truly is a diamond in the rough and easily my most played and favorite game. It has been a privilege to be in on the ground floor so to speak (although there were many before me), before it hits the big time. And Zman games is the big time! Look at another one of their recent game releases - Pandemic (a rare cooperative strategy game) that has become widely popular this year.
Once again, congrats Omar on this great accomplishment!
I also want to add - that someone should publish your comment over on www.boardgamegeek.com. There is not a huge following over there now, but once word gets out that Zman is publishing Arimaa - it will build traction and you would get new interest from that crowd. I would also imagine that the Chess and Go (no pun intended) players that have yet to hear of Arimaa will show some interest.
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| « Last Edit: Jun 24th, 2008, 4:52pm by mistre » |
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Fritzlein
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Arimaa player #706
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Re: Arimaa sets
« Reply #2 on: Jun 24th, 2008, 4:46pm » |
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Although Omar has long encouraged me to write a book on Arimaa, it was his decision to commercially produce Arimaa that finally convinced me. I realized that, not only would the existence of a boxed set create a large enough market for a book to be worthwhile, but also a book could help propel sales of the sets. I believe that Arimaa is the type of game that doesn't draw people in by being superficially flashy, but has the potential to create a fanatical following if we could get more people exposed to it. Releasing a book concurrently with the game could be good timing, and potentially create some serious momentum for this game that we all know is excellent. Apparently Z-man agrees with this logic: he has agreed to publish my book alongside Omar's game.
So far I have drafted sixty pages of a projected one hundred. Depending on the production schedule, I may have to ramp up my speed, at a cost to my postal games and participation in the Mob discussion. I may even be asking community members for help with specific sections, or for actual game positions that illustrate strategic themes.
Like Omar, I will receive some royalties, but my focus is very much on promoting the game to a wider audience rather than on making money. I would like to take this opportunity to thank Omar once again for everything he has done for the Arimaa community and for me personally. The fact that Omar will soon have his first small revenue stream from Arimaa reminds me all the more powerfully of his generosity so far. It would take extraordinary sales for Omar to recoup the thousands he has distributed in prizes and on server rentals, more sales than many winners of "abstract game of the year" get. Yet Omar has permitted us to play here for years for free. For me personally it is hard to fathom how Arimaa has changed my life, and the game was a gift freely given.
Thank you Omar.
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Fritzlein
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Re: Arimaa sets
« Reply #3 on: Jun 24th, 2008, 7:00pm » |
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on Jun 24th, 2008, 4:45pm, mistre wrote:| I also want to add - that someone should publish your comment over on www.boardgamegeek.com. |
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I added a small comment under Arimaa >> News. Was that the right place and tone?
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Adanac
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Re: Arimaa sets
« Reply #4 on: Jun 24th, 2008, 7:15pm » |
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on Jun 24th, 2008, 11:31am, omar wrote:| Well I'm happy to announce that I finally did get back to them and we now have a written agreement in place to have Arimaa sets made. I can't discuss the details of the agreement, but I can tell you that most likely later this year we might actually see some real sets. |
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Congratulations Omar, that’s fantastic!!! Once the game gets widely distributed, you’ll be praised as the greatest abstract strategy game inventor since what’s-his-name created chess 1500 years ago. Arimaa is definitely ready for that big step forward. I feel so lucky to have stumbled upon Arimaa during the early years, and it will be exciting to see its exponential growth in the very near future. And I’m really curious to see all the new opening setups & ideas that emerge after thousands of new players take up the game. I’m pretty sure that current Arimaa theory is at that chess equivalent of pre-Damiano 16th century.
on Jun 24th, 2008, 4:46pm, Fritzlein wrote:
So far I have drafted sixty pages of a projected one hundred. Depending on the production schedule, I may have to ramp up my speed, at a cost to my postal games and participation in the Mob discussion. I may even be asking community members for help with specific sections, or for actual game positions that illustrate strategic themes. |
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If you need any help, I’d be more than happy to chip in…and I’ll have more leisure time in July & August!
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The_Jeh
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Re: Arimaa sets
« Reply #5 on: Jun 24th, 2008, 11:01pm » |
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This news brings me nothing but joy, Omar. Arimaa has filled a hole in my heart. But what inspires me more than the game itself is what I have witnessed over the past several years. I have seen a man, through ingenuity and hard work, realize a dream and bring happiness to many people in the process.
So, does this mean we are free to discuss GM norms, vie for board positions in the IAA, and start planning local affiliates?
And Fritzlein, just curious, but how do you show board positions in your book? Do you have special graphics? Perhaps you could start a new thread for discussion of your book (and pre-release sneak-peeks, or I'm going to die).
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| « Last Edit: Jun 24th, 2008, 11:12pm by The_Jeh » |
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Arimabuff
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Re: Arimaa sets
« Reply #6 on: Jun 25th, 2008, 4:17am » |
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on Jun 24th, 2008, 11:01pm, The_Jeh wrote:This news brings me nothing but joy, Omar. Arimaa has filled a hole in my heart. But what inspires me more than the game itself is what I have witnessed over the past several years. I have seen a man, through ingenuity and hard work, realize a dream and bring happiness to many people in the process.
So, does this mean we are free to discuss GM norms, vie for board positions in the IAA, and start planning local affiliates?
And Fritzlein, just curious, but how do you show board positions in your book? Do you have special graphics? Perhaps you could start a new thread for discussion of your book (and pre-release sneak-peeks, or I'm going to die). |
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Someday it'll be said of Fritzlein : "The man who wrote the book on Arimaa".
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mistre
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Re: Arimaa sets
« Reply #7 on: Jun 25th, 2008, 5:09am » |
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on Jun 24th, 2008, 4:46pm, Fritzlein wrote:| I may even be asking community members for help with specific sections, or for actual game positions that illustrate strategic themes. |
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I would gladly be willing to help any way that I can.
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Fritzlein
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Re: Arimaa sets
« Reply #8 on: Jun 25th, 2008, 6:06am » |
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on Jun 24th, 2008, 11:01pm, The_Jeh wrote:| So, does this mean we are free to discuss GM norms, vie for board positions in the IAA, and start planning local affiliates? |
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I hope so. I think Omar is right that there should be some kind of non-profit to hold the Arimaa Challenge prize fund, and some kind of organization to facilitate clubs and tournaments, but I have no idea how to go about either. Or should it be the same organization?
The reason for the first became clear when I got ready to donate money to the prize fund. I trust Omar absolutely, so I have no qualms cutting him a check on the understanding that it will be used to increase the Challenge Prize fund. At the same time, however, I realized that I wouldn't fork over money to anyone I didn't know personally. Omar hopes to have outside sponsorship for the Arimaa Challenge, but it just isn't going to happen without some kind of body to oversee the funds, guided by some kind of charter. Therefore I am temporarily withholding my money as an incentive for him to get organized, so I can be the first donor when he does. One thought for constructing the charter is that the prize money sit in a money-market account gathering interest, with the principal to be saved for the Challenge, and the interest to be distributed as prizes for yearly tournaments.
A reason for the second organization is that (strange as it seems to me) some people don't want to play board games on the Internet, they only want to play face to face. The arimaa.com gameroom doesn't have to be the center of the Arimaa universe; in fact thinking about it that way may keep the universe smaller than it would otherwise be. Somehow we ought to foster club play. Local clubs will find what works for them for live play, and we can use the feedback to standardize rules. (Only a small fraction of the official rules of chess deal with the abstract terms of engagement; the majority deal with practicalities caused by having real people playing on physical sets.) And yes, it would be great to have titles, and hopefully a live World Championship some day.
I have to remind myself not to get carried away. A big organizational structure will look silly if game sales don't take off, and most abstract strategy games do not sell well. In this day of video games, it seems anachronistic to ask people to sit quietly and think. Z-man himself is an oddity in the game publishing world. The big publishers don't produce good games, they produce games they think will sell. The small publishers that will produce games they love tend not to be financially successful. To have a successful publisher like Z-man take a chance on Arimaa just because it is a good game is a dream come true, but it doesn't mean his gamble will pay off.
By the way, mistre, best of luck getting your own game published. I know it is brutally hard without Harry Potter-themed pieces.
Quote:| And Fritzlein, just curious, but how do you show board positions in your book? Do you have special graphics? |
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Yes, diagrams are tricky. The color images we use on-line are out of the question, because printing in color is prohibitively expensive. We need black-and-white images like they have in chess diagrams. Flattening the color images to black and white won't work either because the current images rely on shading, and grey-scale images are harder to read than solid color figurines and their photo-negative. So actually board diagrams represent a graphic design problem as well as a printing layout problem.
Fortunately for me, the board diagrams are Z-Man's problem. That's an advantage of not self-publishing! I am just doing diagrams in ASCII text like we did in the Mob discussion. Z-Man has produced beautiful rule books with graphical illustrations, so they ought to know how to handle this little issue.
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Fritzlein
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Arimaa player #706
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Re: Arimaa sets
« Reply #9 on: Jun 25th, 2008, 6:18am » |
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on Jun 25th, 2008, 4:17am, Arimabuff wrote:| Someday it'll be said of Fritzlein : "The man who wrote the book on Arimaa". |
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Whatever that amounts to, it will be vastly less impressive than being Omar, the man who invented Arimaa. Also, I'm writing a beginner book, not a deep strategy guide. All of you already know everything I'm going to say about how to play. What I am contributing is (hopefully) a clear, logical, readable expression of the basics, so that it takes newcomers fewer games to get up to speed, and they don't have to learn everything the hard way. I'm counting on chessandgo to write a more advanced strategy guide, and indeed, he already has one partially written.
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arimaa_master
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Re: Arimaa sets
« Reply #10 on: Jun 25th, 2008, 6:23am » |
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on Jun 24th, 2008, 11:31am, omar wrote:Every so often I get emails through the contact page from people asking if there are Arimaa sets available that they can buy. The site clearly states that Arimaa was designed so that it could be played using a chess set. Usually these are people who I don't even see in the gameroom regularly. I just explain to them that they can use a chess set and four coins to play it. One person replied back saying he knew that, but just wanted a set as decor on his coffee table . I found that quite funny.
For a couple years now Karl (Fritzlein) has also been asking me when I'm going to get Arimaa sets made. Of course he knows that it can be played with a chess set (he usually has his most interesting Arimaa postal positions setup on his chess set at home). However his justifications for publishing Arimaa sets made a lot of sense and eventually persuaded me. First he wanted to have the same pieces in a real set that he has become used to online. Also he said it would help legitimatize the game and attract more players to it; players who otherwise might not even consider the game. So maybe then he would have more people to play against when he logs into the gameroom. I couldn't refute that but managed to delay him by saying I'll get sets made if he would write a book about Arimaa . Actually, I didn't think the gameroom or the game client were ready yet for more traffic (I had not even started working on the V2 Flash client at the time); I also wanted to improve the rating system; and make various other improvements to the site. I thought that more players would just put more load on the system and possibly cause crashes and require more support from me; thus I would have even less time to improve the site. Also I like letting Arimaa grow slowly at its own pace without publicizing it too much. But I did assure him that I would eventually get sets made. Karl's wife Katie (Elmo in the gameroom) even did some research to see what it would require to self publish sets and kindly shared it with me. But it looked like it would require a lot of time and effort on my part and I just didn't feel ready for it.
Then about a year ago a game publishing company (Z-man Games http://www.zmangames.com/) contacted me about making Arimaa sets. But I was in the middle of working on the V2 client and the yearly events would be needing my attention soon after that. So I politely asked if I could get back to them in a few months.
Well I'm happy to announce that I finally did get back to them and we now have a written agreement in place to have Arimaa sets made. I can't discuss the details of the agreement, but I can tell you that most likely later this year we might actually see some real sets.
With almost 6 years of continuous play on the Internet and thousands of games played by both computers and humans (with some individuals single handedly playing over a thousand games ), Arimaa will probably be the most play tested game prior to being published. I want to thank everyone (there are way too many people for me to name) who have stuck with Arimaa since its early days and have helped make the game what it is today. You've given me the confidence now to think that Arimaa really is a game that is interesting for people to play. Also I am more confident now then ever before that humans will be able to keep computers at bay for many years to come; and hopefully when the Arimaa challenge is finally won, it really will be due an advancement in software and not just the hardware getting faster.
Even with all that has happened in the Arimaa world so far I think we are still in the early stages of the game and there are lots of interesting things still waiting to happen. Imagine the many interesting challenge matches that are yet to come. Imagine watching the bots improve year to year. Imagine watching the community grow year to year and meeting the many like minded people who have yet to join. Imagine that perhaps the best players of the game aren't even aware of it yet; or maybe they are, but either way the future World championship matches are going to be ever more exciting.
If Arimaa does start to become commercially successful I would like to create a publicly owned company around it so that other can also share in its growth and success. However as long as I have any control over it the bottom line of the company will always be second to the service that it provides to the players and spectators of the game.
Also I am starting to get the feeling that I also need to setup a non-profit organization to ensure the continuity of the games future. I picture this organization being responsible for holding the Arimaa challenge fund and distributing the fund when the challenge is met or has expired. I also picture this organization being the official body that sets the match rules for the World championships and other tournaments. It would also assign official player ratings and titles; along with holding the official games database on which the ratings and titles are based. That database could include games not just from the arimaa.com site, but also other sites. I will write more about this organization in a later post.
I think 2008 is going to be a pivotal year for Arimaa and hopefully the future will be even more fun and exciting for everyone.
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Wow! I am so excited and thrilled I can barely write - I have tears in my eyes right now - dunno what more to say - future is so bright!
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Fritzlein
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Re: Arimaa sets
« Reply #11 on: Jun 25th, 2008, 6:30am » |
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on Jun 25th, 2008, 5:09am, mistre wrote:| I would gladly be willing to help any way that I can. |
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Thanks, I really appreciate that offer. One thing I could use right off the bat is an example of an elephant blockade that has negative value. Years ago I found one that I included in the Wikibook here, but I am trying not to include the same examples in my current text as the Wikibook. Interestingly, people will often pay to buy a book that is available on-line for free, but I want to produce new material regardless of sales, just because more is added to the collective study resource that way. Plus I hope that I'm not just re-hashing the Wikibook with different diagrams. If my perspective has deepened since I wrote there, my presentation of even the simple material should be more mature and lead more naturally to advanced concepts.
Anyway, the best bet for negative-value elephant blockade is probably Gnobot, but I haven't looked yet. If you can remember such a position or dig one up, I would be much obliged.
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mistre
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Re: Arimaa sets
« Reply #12 on: Jun 25th, 2008, 8:19am » |
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on Jun 25th, 2008, 6:30am, Fritzlein wrote:
Thanks, I really appreciate that offer. One thing I could use right off the bat is an example of an elephant blockade that has negative value. Years ago I found one that I included in the Wikibook here, but I am trying not to include the same examples in my current text as the Wikibook. Interestingly, people will often pay to buy a book that is available on-line for free, but I want to produce new material regardless of sales, just because more is added to the collective study resource that way. Plus I hope that I'm not just re-hashing the Wikibook with different diagrams. If my perspective has deepened since I wrote there, my presentation of even the simple material should be more mature and lead more naturally to advanced concepts.
Anyway, the best bet for negative-value elephant blockade is probably Gnobot, but I haven't looked yet. If you can remember such a position or dig one up, I would be much obliged. |
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I looked back at my recent games and found 3 specific instances thanks to my comments (I knew these would come in handy one day!).
The first two were against GnobotBlitz - games 64640 (moves 38-58 ) and 68397 (moves 19-end). I am not sure about these actually being negative blockades though. Maybe I was just able to win despite the blockade.
However, I am sure that my recent game vs CluelessBlitz - game 77217 (moves 8-17) is a perfect example of a negative blockade. He used his E and M to block my E on one trap and let me attack the opposing trap with M-H-D unopposed. He finally broke the blockade on move 17 and I goaled 3 moves later.
I don't know how many examples you need. I know that I have had other games vs. Gnobot where he wasted time with an elaborate E-blocking scheme and allowed me to gain the advantage. I would have to dig some more to find them though.
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| « Last Edit: Jun 25th, 2008, 8:19am by mistre » |
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Fritzlein
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Arimaa player #706
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Re: Arimaa sets
« Reply #13 on: Jun 25th, 2008, 10:15am » |
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on Jun 25th, 2008, 8:19am, mistre wrote:| I don't know how many examples you need. |
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I need only one, and I expect one of these will work perfectly. Thank you!
[EDIT] Yep, game 77217 nicely illustrates a couple of points I wanted to make. Now your win over Clueless will be famous (if the book ever sells).
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| « Last Edit: Jun 25th, 2008, 1:13pm by Fritzlein » |
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chessandgo
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Re: Arimaa sets
« Reply #14 on: Jun 25th, 2008, 1:49pm » |
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This is great news, Omar ! Congratulations for the enormous amount of work you've done so far to make arimaa what it is today. You say that we are at a turning point for arimaa, and I trust you blind, so it's a good time to look back and praise your achievement, for which we'll never praise you enough.
I was already crazily happy that arimaa clothings were created, and it'll even be a huge lot better when game sets and Karl's book will be available. Feels like the progression of arimaa is going to have a boom, and I join all who have expressed their pleasure before me
Thanks also Omar for sharing your stories about what has been done already and about your views for the future.
Have fun playing arimaa, folks !
Jean
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