Arimaa Forum - Print Page


    
      
        Arimaa Forum
        (http://arimaa.com/arimaa/forum/cgi/YaBB.cgi)
      

        Team Games >> 2007 One vs TheMob >> Move 9
        
(Message started by: Fritzlein on Jul 25^th, 2007, 9:47pm)

Title: Move 9
Post by Fritzlein on Jul 25^th, 2007, 9:47pm

I think we are on the right track to worry about an EMH attack. Chessandgo is doing it to me in our postal tournament game, and it is giving me fits. That success will give him all the more reason to try it against the Mob too.

Title: Re: Move 9
Post by mdk on Jul 25^th, 2007, 10:07pm

Any predictions as to what chessandgo's move will be?

Title: Re: Move 9
Post by RonWeasley on Jul 26^th, 2007, 7:13pm

chessandgo plays 9w Mc5s Ed5w Mc4s Ec5w. It looks like he's after a rabbit pull.

Let's plan on a vote beginning Tuesday morning. Voting to end Wednesday morning if 10 or more votes, Wednesday evening otherwise.

Rabbit pull can be blocked by hb6w rb7w cc7w xxxx (md7w?), but the result is awkward for silver.

If we continue to play with the camel by eb5e ec5w Mc3n xxxx (gold can't pull the rabbit right away and must tend the camel again. I see only equality in that line.

eb5e ec5e Mc3n xxxx centralizes our e, but leaves the a4 H unattended and our b6 h unprotected.

Title: Re: Move 9
Post by Fritzlein on Jul 26^th, 2007, 11:02pm

A possibility based on ten seconds of analysis:

9b eb4e ec4w Mc3n rb7w

A judgment based on a further fifteen seconds of analysis:

His threat to pull a rabbit is hollow with so many pieces in danger. He would again have to retreat with three steps. Then it is a question of who can best use the 4th step to make progress. I still like our position slightly better, although my suggested 4th step is not very constructive.

Title: Re: Move 9
Post by The_Jeh on Jul 26^th, 2007, 11:56pm

An alternate 4th step could be hg6e. This puts it one step closer to the h-file rabbits, which we could threaten on subsequent moves by slipping to h3 when plausible. From h6, it can always be put back on g6 if necessary.

Title: Re: Move 9
Post by UruramTururam on Jul 27^th, 2007, 2:07am

I thought about

9b eb4e ec4w Mc3n ce7n (with the plan to move our camel to the left wing - step by step if necessary - while gold E and M are busy on the right one).

Alternatively more aggressive: 9b eb4e ec4w Mc3n md7s (but it seems to be risky)

Title: Re: Move 9
Post by arimaa_master on Jul 27^th, 2007, 4:46am

on 07/27/07 at 02:07:24, UruramTururam wrote:

Ururam, I like your idea to move our camel to the left wing with your 4th step suggestion ce7n. (but 9b eb4e ec4w Mc3n md7s is too risky, indeed).

Thus so far 9b eb4e ec4w Mc3n ce7n would be my first choice.

Second choice (first proposal!): 9b eb4e ec4e Mc3n rb7w
. centralize e + the idea of future hb6w cc7w md7w xxx

Third choice: 9b hb6w rb7w cc7w md7w

Fourth choice: 9b eb4e ec4w Mc3n rb7w

Fifth choice (first proposal!): 9b eb4e ec4e Mc3n hg6e

Sixth choice: 9b eb4e ec4w Mc3n hg6e

Title: Re: Move 9
Post by Fritzlein on Jul 27^th, 2007, 8:33am

on 07/27/07 at 02:07:24, UruramTururam wrote:

Alternatively more aggressive: 9b eb4e ec4w Mc3n md7s (but it seems to be risky)

From my first look at this move I also thought it was too risky. But now I don't remember what I was afraid of.

9b eb4e ec4w Mc3n md7s
10w Eb5e Ec5e Ed5w md6s (the only potent tactical threat)
10b ce7s ce6s md5n ce5n
11w Mc4s Ec5e Ed5e md6s
11b dd8s dd7s md5w mc5n

leaves the gold horse on a4 in serious strategical danger. Of course there are many other lines to examine, including
9b eb4e ec4w Mc3n md7s
10w Eb5e Ec5e md6e Ed5n
but for the moment I rather like UruramTururam's move.

Title: Re: Move 9
Post by arimaa_master on Jul 30^th, 2007, 4:51am

on 07/27/07 at 08:33:55, Fritzlein wrote:

Yes, you are right, now I cannot see any danger for us too. Anyway this move will be only my fifth choice (thus current fifth and sixth choices will be sixth and seventh choices respectively).

Title: Re: Move 9
Post by RonWeasley on Jul 30^th, 2007, 9:06am

UT's advance of the camel looks OK to me. Variations where gold goes after the m usually end up with silver threatening to win an exchange, H for c, for example. Gold will not go that far but will return the E to protect the H (and the D).

In the short term we get a more flexible camel that is still centralized. Gold will probably pull the rabbit on 10w. How will we respond?

This shows the value of mentioning moves that seem to have problems at first glance, but might be solved by others upon examination.

Title: Re: Move 9
Post by Fritzlein on Jul 30^th, 2007, 1:52pm

on 07/30/07 at 09:06:26, RonWeasley wrote:

Gold will probably pull the rabbit on 10w.

I doubt chessandgo will pull the rabbit after UT's move. Gold's position looks awful (at least at first glance) after
9b eb4e ec4w Mc3n md7s
10w hb6e Eb5n Eb6s rb7s
10b Mc4n eb4e md6s dd8s

Quote:

This shows the value of mentioning moves that seem to have problems at first glance, but might be solved by others upon examination.

Absolutely. The Mob can easily shrug off the effect of wrong ideas that are contributed. What we can't compensate for is good ideas that aren't contributed. Keep talking, everyone!

Title: Re: Move 9
Post by 99of9 on Jul 30^th, 2007, 2:46pm

on 07/27/07 at 04:46:05, arimaa_master wrote:

Thus so far 9b eb4e ec4w Mc3n ce7n would be my first choice.

What's the point of moving the cat forward? What does that gain us? An exposed cat is all that I can see!

Title: Re: Move 9
Post by arimaa_master on Jul 31^st, 2007, 5:29am

on 07/30/07 at 14:46:55, 99of9 wrote:

What's the point of moving the cat forward? What does that gain us? An exposed cat is all that I can see!

;D Funny that I am not the only one mind manipulated here - maybe Ururam Tururam is some kind of magician :) coz I was about to write very similar comment to this move (like you did) - actually this comment was written (but I didn´t send it finally) - coz I suggested in my not-sent-comment to not expose the cat and that it will be better to not block e6 point to leave open space to our camel to get quickly to the other wing but then suddenly I realize that ce7n - is from the gold's side so "north" is our "south" - so the cat move is the "good one" :)

And what it will gain to us? Read UT's comment 8)

Title: Re: Move 9
Post by 99of9 on Jul 31^st, 2007, 6:25am

Oh, sorry, you're right - I mixed up north and south. It's better now, but I still don't like it much, because it will be a little slower to bring the cat into the game later. If we're really trying to get our camel across, let's move the camel now. (Moving the camel now does not force us to cross sides with it, so even though I haven't decided whether to swing the camel across, I still like this move.)

Title: Re: Move 9
Post by RonWeasley on Jul 31^st, 2007, 7:10am

Coincidently, I wrote, then erased, a comment about the exposed cat and realized, just before posting, that the cat went backward and not forward. Great minds think alike!

I'm going to be gone Aug. 4-11 and also 16-19. Harry has asked me to help him find some ... things. So we might need a different moderator during that time. I can give the appropriate spells and charms to the substitute. Any volunteers?

Title: Re: Move 9
Post by RonWeasley on Aug 1^st, 2007, 3:38pm

The mob chooses 9b eb43 ec4w Md3n md7s. 8 votes out of a possible 16. We are only half the mob we could be!

Title: Re: Move 9
Post by Fritzlein on Aug 1^st, 2007, 3:48pm

For the record

. . . . . . . . . . 1. 2. 3. 4. 5. 6.
1. eb4e ec4w Mc3n md7s (pull M, m to d6) . . - 6 6 7 7 6
2. eb4e ec4w Mc3n rb7w (pull M, r to a7) . . 1 - 3 3 5 5
3. eb4e ec4w Mc3n ce7n (pull M, c to e8) . . 1 3 - 5 5 5
4. eb4e ec4w Mc3n hg6e (pull M, h to h6) . . 0 3 2 - 5 5
5. eb4e ec4e Mc3n hg6e (pull M, e to d4, h to h6) 0 1 2 1 - 3
6. eb4e ec4e Mc3n rb7w (pull M, e to d4, r to a7) 1 1 1 1 1 -

According to Schulze, the choices 2. and 3. were tied for second, but it looks to me like 3. should have finished ahead since it beat 4., whereas 2. only tied with 4. If that tiebreaker is used, the UruramTururam's two suggestions finished first and second!

Title: Re: Move 9
Post by Fritzlein on Aug 1^st, 2007, 3:54pm

on 08/01/07 at 15:38:02, RonWeasley wrote:

8 votes out of a possible 16. We are only half the mob we could be!

It is tempting to extend the voting to try to get more participation, but I think you are doing the Mob a favor to keep up the pace and get back a little of the reserve we spent in the early going. Our position doesn't seem to have suffered the last few moves; if anything I think we are keeping a slight advantage. Furthermore no one has asked for extended discussion or voting even when you have offered.

Maybe later in the game the Mob will be more unruly and less listless...

Title: Re: Move 9
Post by UruramTururam on Aug 11^th, 2007, 5:13pm

on 07/31/07 at 05:29:37, arimaa_master wrote:

Funny that I am not the only one mind manipulated here - maybe Ururam Tururam is some kind of magician :)

As a side note - my full name & title is: Ururam Tururam, The Experimenting Warlock - so you are right!