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        Arimaa >> General Discussion >> botbashers - handicap games idea
        
(Message started by: mistre on Apr 20^th, 2008, 1:11pm)

Title: botbashers - handicap games idea
Post by mistre on Apr 20^th, 2008, 1:11pm

I had an idea that I would like to implement for the botbasher page handicap section that I think might ease the animosity concerning handicap records.

My idea is for each person who is actively botbashing (that would be Arimabuff, 99of9, myself, and Arimaa_Master) - to have their own individual column for their best handicap vs. each bot. I would also include PMertens, as his handicaps are the only other ones that are in not immediate danger of being broken. In order to conserve space, there would be just one column regardless of whether you played gold or silver. I suppose if you achieved the same handicap for each color, you could list both games if you really want.

By doing it this way, everyone would just be trying to beat their own records (you can't erase someone else's), but since the results are shown side-by-side there is still some way to compare feats. If at any time, some other player wishes to start handicap bot-bashing - they can let me know and I will add them to the page.

Speaking personally, I don't go out of my way to try to beat other player's records, I just strive to improve on my own. The current set-up will just result in the player who botbashes the most frequent to own all of the records, until there comes a time when someone DARES to beat his record, in which he will seek vengeance on that person.

No one will be able to "STEAL" another person's record!

Title: Re: botbashers - handicap games idea
Post by Arimabuff on Apr 20^th, 2008, 3:17pm

Your idea may resolve all conflicts but at the same time it'll make the page meaningless. Who cares about a list of personal scores? Not me. You may as well forget about the whole thing and delete the page altogether. What you're proposing here is no less than to burn the village in order to save it. I won't be a party to any of this.

Title: Re: botbashers - handicap games idea
Post by mistre on Apr 20^th, 2008, 4:15pm

I kind of knew your reaction would be what it was. So, you would rather I delete the page altogether?

How can you say the records would be meaningless? It is not like everyone on this site is botbashing. At last count there are only 4 of us, and only you and 99of9 are in any heated competition. By separating the records, the ONLY thing you are doing is removing the controversy between you and 99of9.

Are you saying that any botbashing exploit is completely meaningless if it is not the best? Maybe all of those no-capture immobilizations should be deleted as well then. You weren't the first to do it, PMertens was.

I am tired of your self-serving rants and ravings and your complete disregard for the Arimaa community as a whole.

Title: Re: botbashers - handicap games idea
Post by Arimabuff on Apr 20^th, 2008, 4:49pm

on 04/20/08 at 16:15:04, mistre wrote:

I forgot about PMertens and Arimaanator even though ironically I was the one who dug it up. At the time, I resolved the no capture immo. of Bomb it was considered almost impossible by the best players here, including Fritzlein as his own comment of the game, (check it out if you don't believe me) attests. That's what made it something unique and in my view deserving of being remembered.

Title: Re: botbashers - handicap games idea
Post by Polyfractal on Apr 20^th, 2008, 5:41pm

That sounds like a fantastic idea Mistre. Perhaps we will have fewer drama-fest threads mucking up the forum then.

Arimabuff: As a relative newcomer to Arimaa and the community, I'd just like to point out how entirely meaningless this whole argument is from an outside point of view. Blatantly silly infact. You are competing over some flimsy Internet bragging rights which will be known by at most 20 people. Furthermore, even if someone "cheated", you are treating this as if someone has gotten away with murder and arson. This is an Internet title on a wiki to a board game played by a handful of individuals. There is absolutely no need to be throwing offensive words or insulting the characters of others. You would be hard-pressed to find a more materially worthless title to fight over.

From an outside view, it looks like you are throwing a tantrum because the Internet is not validating your existence enough. No offense intended, I'm just explaining how it views to one that just arrived and is unaffiliated with anyone.

Title: Re: botbashers - handicap games idea
Post by IdahoEv on Apr 20^th, 2008, 7:52pm

on 04/20/08 at 13:11:55, mistre wrote:

I had an idea that I would like to implement for the botbasher page handicap section that I think might ease the animosity concerning handicap records.

The animosity we see has very little to do with the setup, and everything to do with personality style. When people respond to all slights (real, imagined, or manufactured) with vitriol, you can't repair that with contest setup.

This is, in fact, a large part of why I stopped running my 2006-era monthly botbash contests (with different challenges each month was the idea) after only two months. It just wasn't worth the interpersonal stress that was caused.

I do think the idea has merit because a single long-term competition (best handicap) has an upper limit. It's like the world record for running the mile ... as time goes on, fewer and fewer new records will be set. Limited-time challenges, with varying handicaps, give new people the opportunity to jump in once in a while. However I found that even within a month, a single individual with too much time on his hands can quickly lock out opponents so that they have no incentive to even try.

Your idea would give people a way of challenging themselves even if they can't take the crown, and that's nice. Unfortunately, people also do like to compete with each other.

Title: Re: botbashers - handicap games idea
Post by mistre on Apr 20^th, 2008, 8:44pm

Yeah, I figured as much. I was asking for it when I took this whole thing on. :-/

I actually have some good ideas for challenges, but I am very hesitant to run them, because like you said, one person who has a lot of time on his hands can monopolize it. If there was a way you could limit the number of attempts, it might be fun, but I don't know how you would do that.

Aside from more strict challenge guidelines, you are either left with a mess like we have now, or not make it a competition and just keep track of your own records.