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        Arimaa >> General Discussion >> Some kzb52 puzzles
        
(Message started by: kzb52 on Feb 18^th, 2015, 9:44pm)

Title: Some kzb52 puzzles
Post by kzb52 on Feb 18^th, 2015, 9:44pm

I like the idea of making puzzles. It's fun! I had a few random ideas over the last couple of weeks, and decided to make them into something. These are hopefully just the beginning, I reserve the right to change them later (and add more, when inspiration strikes me).

In the meantime, I'd appreciate any feedback from other players. For example, if it's useful to anyone for me to post the position as text (Ra1 rb8 etc..) let me know and I'll add those in. "Feedback" includes improving and expanding on my ideas! I'd love to see what you guys create.

These four puzzles are meant to be fairly easy, and "just for fun". If you're one of those top players who can solve them quickly, please use some sort of spoiler tag and/or wait a few days before posting here.

In all the puzzles, two moves are different if the positions after they are played are distinct (so you can't get two different moves by rearranging the order of steps).

Enjoy!

#1: Gold to move, which silver pieces can be captured immediately? (don't worry about giving up goal, gold is lost anyway)

http://arimaa.com/arimaa/notconv/old/boardimg.php?orient=n&size=300&imgtype=jpeg&ranks=1r4r/rHc2rcD/rm/1E3M/1R1dr/1DedCR/2H1r/

#2: Gold to play, how many ways can you move the c3 silver rabbit off its current square (and what are they)? (inspired by game 317656 spcornelius-bot_Bomb2005P2)

http://arimaa.com/arimaa/notconv/old/boardimg.php?orient=n&size=300&imgtype=jpeg&ranks=5r/2c2r/3c2rr/1dd/rrr/RErhMRD/HmDhRRe/3R3R

#3: (version 1.1) Silver to play, find the best move! (inspired by game 289132 kzb52-ocmiente)

http://arimaa.com/arimaa/notconv/old/boardimg.php?orient=n&size=300&imgtype=jpeg&ranks=d1rrmrc/RrcrHhr/1dEReDhD/rC1MRH1r/R3R/7C/5RR/

#4: Gold to move, how many moves end with a rabbit on f6 (and what are they)? (if you move a rabbit to f6 and it's captured instantly, it doesn't count)

http://arimaa.com/arimaa/notconv/old/boardimg.php?orient=n&size=300&imgtype=jpeg&ranks=5r1r/2cCrd1h/1r4HR/1hR1EmdR/1D1eRRr/1C3MDR/2R/

Title: Re: Some kzb52 puzzles
Post by supersamu on Feb 19^th, 2015, 4:38am

Here are my solutions:

Quote:

Puzzle 1:
b6, c3, c7, e2, e4

Puzzle 2:
There are 4 moves:
1.Push the b2 camel to b1,
1.1 and then push the c3 rabbit to b3 with the silver dog, sacrificing it in the process
1.2 and then pull the c3 rabbit to c2 with the silver dog moving to c1
2. push the silver horse on d3 to d4 with the gold camel and then pull the silver rabbit from c3 to d3 with the gold camel
3. pull the silver horse on d3 to e3 with the gold camel and then push the silver rabbit on c3 to d3 with the gold elephant

Puzzle 3:
Capture the gold elephant by pulling the e7 horse to e8 with the silver camel moving to d8, and then pulling the d6 rabbit to e6 with the silver elephant ending on e7.

Puzzle 4:
There are 2 ways:
gold elephant to d5, gold rabbit e4-e5-e6-f6;
gold horse to g7, gold elephant to e6, gold rabbit from h6 to f6

Here is how I wrote them in spoilers:

Code:

[quote][color=#DEE7EF]
text here
[/color][/quote]

I would say that posting the position as text might be useful for more complicated puzzles.

Title: Re: Some kzb52 puzzles
Post by chessandgo on Feb 19^th, 2015, 6:02am

I think teleporting the ra5 to d8 would make problem 3 better (preventing supersamu's solution, and leaving just one strong move).

Title: Re: Some kzb52 puzzles
Post by browni3141 on Feb 19^th, 2015, 10:06am

on 02/19/15 at 06:02:02, chessandgo wrote:

I think teleporting the ra5 to d8 would make problem 3 better (preventing supersamu's solution, and leaving just one strong move).

That make gold's response a little more complicated.

Title: Re: Some kzb52 puzzles
Post by chessandgo on Feb 19^th, 2015, 11:38am

I don't understand.

Title: Re: Some kzb52 puzzles
Post by browni3141 on Feb 19^th, 2015, 12:17pm

on 02/19/15 at 11:38:25, chessandgo wrote:

I don't understand.

After 1s g6n f6e e6e d6e, 2g d5n e4e h4wn or similar doesn't trouble silver because 2s e8w e7n e6n f6w gets the elephant out of the trap and on a strong square, but this is not possible with d8 occupied. It makes for more calculation, and this is supposed to be a beginner friendly puzzle.

Title: Re: Some kzb52 puzzles
Post by kzb52 on Feb 19^th, 2015, 3:38pm

Wow, thanks for the feedback guys. You didn't waste anytime going through these :)

I've taken a closer look at #3 and tried to make it clearer. As it stands right now it's just not good enough. What I've done is taken the OLD puzzle 3 that is obsolete and put it here. The new, improved version takes its place in the first post.

Bad Puzzle #3 (silver to play, find the best move)

http://arimaa.com/arimaa/notconv/old/boardimg.php?orient=n&size=300&imgtype=jpeg&ranks=r1r1mrc/RrcrHd1r/1hEReDhD/rR1MRH1r/R3C2R/7C//

This change renders supersamu's solution to #3 above incorrect. His solutions for #1 and #2 are correct. However, there is an error (which he already knows about) in his solution for #4. I have also slightly modified #4 (replacing the f7 cat with a silver dog).

Let me know if you have any further comments/questions/concerns.

Title: Re: Some kzb52 puzzles
Post by kzb52 on Feb 25^th, 2015, 12:21pm

Here's a couple more. Thanks to lightvector for pointing the first one out to me and browni for helping verify the second.

#5. Silver just played dg3w Cg2w df3s rg4s. Gold is lost, but there is a single move for gold that delays the loss one more turn. What is it? (this is taken directly from game 307442, harvestsnow-kzb52, move 30)

http://arimaa.com/arimaa/notconv/old/boardimg.php?orient=n&size=300&imgtype=jpeg&ranks=1rHr/c1m2r/1hRc2r/r1M3Rr/D1HrER1R/1R1ed1rR/2DRCdR/

#6. Silver to move and win in 2. (inspired by game 326132, bot_PragmaticTheory2010Blitz-bot_Jumbo)

http://arimaa.com/arimaa/notconv/old/boardimg.php?orient=n&size=300&imgtype=jpeg&ranks=/2E/5rd/r1H3Dr/rcHC/re1R1M/RRh2DRR/2R3R

Have fun!

Title: Re: Some kzb52 puzzles
Post by Manuel on Feb 26^th, 2015, 4:23am

In #6, I think ra5 should be on b5 to indeed be a win in 2. Am I right?

Title: Re: Some kzb52 puzzles
Post by harvestsnow on Feb 26^th, 2015, 7:39am

on 02/26/15 at 04:23:22, Manuel wrote:

In #6, I think ra5 should be on b5 to indeed be a win in 2. Am I right?

No.

The goal works with that rabbit on either of those places.

Title: Re: Some kzb52 puzzles
Post by clyring on Feb 26^th, 2015, 5:07pm

The only goal pattern I can see where teleporting the ra5 to b5 would seem to help is eb3ee ra3e, but gold is able to either get his camel to d2 and freeze the horse or block the goal threat by moving the Rc1 to b1 depending on where silver pushes the Rd3, so I don't think it would even create an extraneous solution.

Title: Re: Some kzb52 puzzles
Post by browni3141 on Feb 26^th, 2015, 6:24pm

on 02/26/15 at 17:07:03, clyring wrote:

I believe a second goal does become possible if the rabbit is moved.

Edit: My bot confirms this by finding two goals.

Title: Re: Some kzb52 puzzles
Post by clyring on Feb 26^th, 2015, 7:11pm

I see what you mean. That was very difficult to visualize while looking at the board with the rabbit still on a5.

Title: Re: Some kzb52 puzzles
Post by robinz on Feb 28^th, 2015, 3:38am

I'm confused by this talk, because I think I've seen a nice goal in 2, but my solution definitely wouldn't work without that rabbit on a5! (I've probably missed something though, I find it quite hard to visualise future board positions in Arimaa, which is kind of a problem in sharp endgames...)

Title: Re: Some kzb52 puzzles
Post by kzb52 on Mar 1^st, 2015, 4:05pm

Let me try to clear up your confusion.

The puzzle as it stands (with an a5 silver rabbit) is a unique win in 2. Find it, and you can consider my puzzle "solved".

However, if that rabbit were moved from a5 to b5, then there would be 2 wins in two (it turns out they are the original and one extra).

If that pesky rabbit was removed from the board entirely, then I don't believe there are any wins in 2.

Hopefully that helps. If you want, feel free to post your solution. I was hoping to have all the answers in this thread somewhere, eventually. If you do that, I request that you use the method supersamu used earlier in this thread, so that it's not spoiled for others.

Title: Re: Some kzb52 puzzles
Post by robinz on Mar 1^st, 2015, 4:40pm

Fair enough. In fact, I've just realised that I'm the rabbit being on b5 still makes my solution valid, so it could well be right. Spoilers for dicussion below:

Quote:

My solution ws the fun elephant sacrifice of Eb3e rb3e Hb2w Ec3x rc1n. I don't see any defense to his (but could be missing something, and couldn't be certain it is a unique solution, although I trust you that it is, should it be correct). My initial confusion was that I thought the rabbit on a5 was necessary to prevent the gold horse pushing its way to A4 and freezing the rabbit, leaving silver with no goal and a totally lost game, but I've only just seen that the rabbit being on b5 also prevents this by preventing the b4 cat being pushed. I don't immediately see what other solution this would allow, but now I'm reasonably confident my solution - which I came up with after just a few second - was correct.

Title: Re: Some kzb52 puzzles
Post by kzb52 on Mar 1^st, 2015, 5:48pm

Yeah that's right :)

Title: Re: Some kzb52 puzzles
Post by kzb52 on Mar 18^th, 2015, 10:15pm

I'm thrilled that this thread is still going strong. I have four more positions to put up here. Keep in mind that I'm still waiting for a correct answer to puzzles 3, 4, and 5.

These puzzles are a little different than what I've posted in the past. In fact, they aren't puzzles so much as a (incomplete) sampling of important positions. Each board is divided into four quadrants which do not interfere with each other. In each case, the attacking side (gold in ranks 4-8 and silver in ranks 1-4) has one rabbit. Your task is to goal with that rabbit.

The goaling move is often not unique because a big part of the purpose isn't to provide a hard puzzle, it's to list common patterns. Any arimaa player worth his salt should be familiar with all of these (IMHO ;) ) I'm sure I'm forgetting some things, feel free to suggest additions, tweaks, or improvements.

#7
http://arimaa.com/arimaa/notconv/old/boardimg.php?orient=n&size=300&imgtype=jpeg&ranks=cHd1eHmE/1Re1dRr/5C//6c//RrC2DrH/1hC2DhR

#8
http://arimaa.com/arimaa/notconv/old/boardimg.php?orient=n&size=300&imgtype=jpeg&ranks=1d3h1d/rMr2HcH/R5Rr/c/5M/r3m2r/Rh2R1dR/R1M3RR

#9
http://arimaa.com/arimaa/notconv/old/boardimg.php?orient=n&size=300&imgtype=jpeg&ranks=h4H1r/Rr3rrR/1H///1r5C/DhD2Ehr/5R1D

#10
http://arimaa.com/arimaa/notconv/old/boardimg.php?orient=n&size=300&imgtype=jpeg&ranks=dHc1rHd/RH3cRr/6E////r1R3hr/RCh1C1HR

Title: Re: Some kzb52 puzzles
Post by deep_blue on Mar 23^rd, 2015, 11:34am

I am not worth my salt. :'(
I wasn't familiar with all of puzzles 7-10.(I guess I knew about 3/4 of them) Though it only takes a fraction of a second to find the goal so at least now I know them. ;)