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Topic: Move 27 (Read 6581 times) |
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Hippo
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Re: Move 27
« Reply #15 on: Dec 16th, 2009, 1:31am » |
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on Dec 15th, 2009, 9:57pm, aaaa wrote:| Quad: 27g Re1n Ed5s Ed4w Df4e |
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I hope dog for dog exchange would be in our favor so
27s rg5w hg6sn Dg4n
28g Ec4e Db4es Ed4w
28s hg6n Dg5nw hg7s is OK for us and the expected reply would be
27s eb5e Rb5e db4n rg5w and I it does not look like an improvement for us.
Actually I don't understand the Re1n step.
So proposals so far are:
1) 27g He3e Df4ee Rg5s
27s ec5s Rb5e db4n Cb3n
28g Ec5nwe rb6ex we are fine
27s Cb3e db4s ra4e ca5s
2) 27g Rh1w Ra2n Cb3s Df4e
27s rg5w hg6sn Dg4n
28g Ed5e rf5s Ee5e Dg5s
3) 27g various dog cat rotations (actually I do not support them)
4) 27g Rh1w Ed5n de6s Ed6e
27s ec5e de5e xxx xxx (db4s Cb3w?)
5) 27g Rh1w Ed5en de6w
6) 27g He3e Ed5en de6w
7) 27g Ed5n de6s Ed6e Df4n
27s rg5ssss 
8) 27g He3een Ed5n
27s Cb3w db4s ec5s xxx (re7e)
9) 27g Ed5sw Df4e Re1n
27s ec5e Rb5e db4n rg5w
A) 27g Ed5sw Rh1w Dc2w
27s ec5e Rb5e db4n xxx (re7e?)
B) 27g He3e Ed5n de6s Ed6e
27s ec5e de5e xxx xxx (ed5se) or (Cb3w db4s)?
C) 27g Df4es rg5s Ed5e
D) 27g He3ee Ed5sw
27s Cb3e db4s ra4e ca5s
28g Ec4sn db3ex Ca3e ... oops C is on c3 not a3
27s ec5es Cd3w ed4s
28g Ra2n Df4ee rg5s
E) 27g He3e Dc2n Cb3w Dc3w
F) 27g He3e Dc2n Cb3s Dc3w
G) 27g He3e Ed5sw Dc2w
Now, my favorit is G).
Updated game tree ... here it's good place on the start of the 2nd page.
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| « Last Edit: Dec 22nd, 2009, 8:09am by Hippo » |
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RonWeasley
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Re: Move 27
« Reply #16 on: Dec 16th, 2009, 6:42am » |
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I'm looking at Ed5n de6s Ed6e He3e.
Not sure if it's good, but there's the horse threat and the g file is covered. I'm most worried about 27s ec5e ed5s ed4e de5e
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jdb
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Re: Move 27
« Reply #17 on: Dec 17th, 2009, 7:35am » |
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on Dec 16th, 2009, 6:42am, RonWeasley wrote:I'm looking at Ed5n de6s Ed6e He3e.
Not sure if it's good, but there's the horse threat and the g file is covered. I'm most worried about 27s ec5e ed5s ed4e de5e |
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This elephant position looks good for silver against alot of gold moves. If the elephant sits on e4, He3 and Df4 are both looking a little exposed.
Attacking the dog on b4, leads to something like rb6w Rb5n db4n and the dog is fairly safe.
Maybe something like the following would work,
27w Df4e Dg4s rg5s Ed5e
If silver puts the e on d3, gold can just retreat the horse. It also provides a threat against the dog and rabbit. The horse is more exposed now too.
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| « Last Edit: Dec 17th, 2009, 7:35am by jdb » |
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Adanac
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Re: Move 27
« Reply #18 on: Dec 17th, 2009, 12:41pm » |
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For long-term strategy, I like the idea of just placing our horse on g3, dog on b3 and giving up our b5 rabbit. We should be able to soon recapture a silver rabbit because Karl has weak advanced rabbits on both sides.
27g He3e Hf3e Ed5s Ed4w
27s ec5e ed5s Cd3w ed4s
28g Ra2n Df4e Dg4e rg5s
Our 29th move would either be a rabbit capture or a dog rotation onto b3.
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RonWeasley
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Re: Move 27
« Reply #19 on: Dec 17th, 2009, 1:40pm » |
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on Dec 17th, 2009, 12:41pm, Adanac wrote:For long-term strategy, I like the idea of just placing our horse on g3, dog on b3 and giving up our b5 rabbit. We should be able to soon recapture a silver rabbit because Karl has weak advanced rabbits on both sides.
27g He3e Hf3e Ed5s Ed4w
27s ec5e ed5s Cd3w ed4s
28g Ra2n Df4e Dg4e rg5s
Our 29th move would either be a rabbit capture or a dog rotation onto b3.
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So far, my analysis supports this strategy. I think the game will move to a fight around c3. Silver may give up an eastern rabbit to put a dog on b3 and try to keep it there. Once a gold dog gets on b3, play goes to a fight around c6. This is where we apply our extra cat. The horses seem to want to stare at each other because if one leaves, the other moves in and tries to goal a rabbit.
Even the move I suggested earlier seems to end up with the same strategic game. I can't save the b5 rabbit because the E is needed on c4 eventually. Adanac's move look's like it gets us to that position with minimum risk.
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jdb
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Re: Move 27
« Reply #20 on: Dec 18th, 2009, 6:20am » |
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on Dec 17th, 2009, 12:41pm, Adanac wrote:For long-term strategy, I like the idea of just placing our horse on g3, dog on b3 and giving up our b5 rabbit. We should be able to soon recapture a silver rabbit because Karl has weak advanced rabbits on both sides.
27g He3e Hf3e Ed5s Ed4w
27s ec5e ed5s Cd3w ed4s
28g Ra2n Df4e Dg4e rg5s
Our 29th move would either be a rabbit capture or a dog rotation onto b3.
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One question, why is the horse on g3 preferred over the dog on g3?
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RonWeasley
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Re: Move 27
« Reply #21 on: Dec 18th, 2009, 9:27am » |
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on Dec 18th, 2009, 6:20am, jdb wrote:
One question, why is the horse on g3 preferred over the dog on g3?
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I think it's to keep the silver horse off of g3. If silver gets a e-d attack against c3, the gold E has to go there and might not be able to address an h on g3. Also an h on g3 would invite silver rabbits to try penetrating down the h file.
Maybe a better attacking player than me has another answer.
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jdb
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Re: Move 27
« Reply #22 on: Dec 18th, 2009, 1:36pm » |
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on Dec 17th, 2009, 12:41pm, Adanac wrote:For long-term strategy, I like the idea of just placing our horse on g3, dog on b3 and giving up our b5 rabbit. We should be able to soon recapture a silver rabbit because Karl has weak advanced rabbits on both sides.
27g He3e Hf3e Ed5s Ed4w
27s ec5e ed5s Cd3w ed4s
28g Ra2n Df4e Dg4e rg5s
Our 29th move would either be a rabbit capture or a dog rotation onto b3.
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27g He3e Hf3e Ed5s Ed4w
27s Cb3e db4s ra4e ca5s
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RonWeasley
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Re: Move 27
« Reply #23 on: Dec 20th, 2009, 11:18am » |
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on Dec 18th, 2009, 1:36pm, jdb wrote:
27g He3e Hf3e Ed5s Ed4w
27s Cb3e db4s ra4e ca5s
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That's an uncomfortable response.
How about:
27g Dc2n Cb3w Dc3w He3e
It drives us to a defensive position but it seems like we can trap rabbits from here.
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Hippo
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Re: Move 27
« Reply #24 on: Dec 20th, 2009, 3:18pm » |
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Seems
27s Cb3e db4s ra4e ca5s is an attack requiring response in the west wing in most cases so the dog cat rotation may be important. And the move 1) become really dangerous with that (at least we cannot take the rabbit as planned). Our E should hurry to c4 ...
28g Esw Cd3n Cc3e
28s db3w rb4ss da3e
29g Dc2s rb2en Dc1n
29s ca4e ra7sss
30g Cd3e rc3e Ce3s rd3e
30s ec5es Cd4e ec4s
31g Hf3e re3ex re1w xxx
31s db3e ra4ses
32g rb2n dc2w rb3w db2n
32s dc3s ed3ww Db3s
33g Rd2n Ec4s dc2e Ec3s
But there can be better moves for silver and the situation was rather dangerous.
on Dec 20th, 2009, 11:18am, RonWeasley wrote:
27g Dc2n Cb3w Dc3w He3e
It drives us to a defensive position but it seems like we can trap rabbits from here.
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... is cat on a3 better than on b2?
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| « Last Edit: Dec 20th, 2009, 3:26pm by Hippo » |
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jdb
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Re: Move 27
« Reply #25 on: Dec 20th, 2009, 5:09pm » |
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on Dec 15th, 2009, 10:19pm, Sconibulus wrote:Ice: Possibility one gives fritz a goal by charging the rabbit.
I'm a fan of Ed5s Ed5w Rh1w Dc2w
It'll give us a threat on that dog and make those rabbits in the east less dangerous by filling the open path. |
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In light of recent developments, I think this move deserves a closer look.
Silver needs at least 3 steps to safe the b4 dog. It can't go to b3, since it can be captured. So that puts a delay in silver coming after the c3 trap.
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RonWeasley
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Re: Move 27
« Reply #26 on: Dec 22nd, 2009, 5:56am » |
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on Dec 15th, 2009, 10:19pm, Sconibulus wrote:Ice: Possibility one gives fritz a goal by charging the rabbit.
I'm a fan of Ed5s Ed5w Rh1w Dc2w
It'll give us a threat on that dog and make those rabbits in the east less dangerous by filling the open path. |
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We seem to be going to an E on c4 position and sacrificing the b4 rabbit. I'm worried about the silver e going to d3 on the next move for this and for other moves, like using He3e instead of Rh1w. I think we hold on, but I can't find a way to gain back the initiative.
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jdb
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Re: Move 27
« Reply #27 on: Dec 22nd, 2009, 7:05am » |
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on Dec 22nd, 2009, 5:56am, RonWeasley wrote:
We seem to be going to an E on c4 position and sacrificing the b4 rabbit. I'm worried about the silver e going to d3 on the next move for this and for other moves, like using He3e instead of Rh1w. I think we hold on, but I can't find a way to gain back the initiative. |
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For the sake of discussion, lets say
27g Ed5s Ed4w Dc2w He3e
27s ec5e ed4s Cd3e ed4s
28g Cb3e Db2n Cc3s Ra2n
On 27s, silver could push the cat on to the trap.
I am indifferent between Rh1w and He3e. Something is required to protect the g file, and they both get the job done.
Silver's attack on the c3 trap has been stopped. We will be able to frame a rabbit there eventually. This should allow us to have the elephants together.
There are rabbits available for capture in the f3 trap. Gold needs to threaten rabbit captures on both traps at once. Silver does not have enough pieces left to cover that and even a weak goal attack.
I can't see a way to save the b4 rabbit without giving up a strong goal attack.
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RonWeasley
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Re: Move 27
« Reply #28 on: Dec 23rd, 2009, 6:52am » |
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I think it's time to vote. Any final comments? Should the voting period be longer due to holidays?
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Adanac
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Re: Move 27
« Reply #29 on: Dec 29th, 2009, 8:39am » |
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Yes, I think we should vote soon.
It seems that either the silver dog will be able to reach b3 or the silver horse will reach g3. We can't prevent both. I'd rather prevent the 1st possibility because if the silver horse does occupy g3 then we still have the option of a horse hostage with our elephant.
I'm probably going to vote for moving our dog to b3 and horse to f3.
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