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Topic: Move 33 (Read 3983 times) |
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RonWeasley
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Silver moves 32s hc5e hd5s Re5w db4e.
Just like we predicted.
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Nombril
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Re: Move 33
« Reply #1 on: Mar 26th, 2010, 4:22am » |
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Ron, are you doing any trash talk in the moves? I saw something earlier about it. I wonder if we should tell Fritzlein that quad is correctly predicting his moves?
I went through the Move 32 thread to pull out some of the suggested responses, in order of appearance. I've put in some first impressions and questions.
on Mar 9th, 2010, 1:52am, chessandgo wrote:
I think that:
32g Hg3s rg4s rg3w rf3x Hg2n
32s hc5e hd5s Re5w db4e
33g dd6w Ee6w Rd5e Ed6e
is fine, silver could semi-repeat the position with:
33s hd4n hd5w Re5w dc6e
34g Rd2n Rd3n Rd5e Re2n
This looks good for us, the extra advanced Rabbits make this exchange excellent for gold, so I don't think silver can afford such a 33s move. |
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I'm developing more respect for the no-repeat rule. If we like the position and our opponent doesn't, why not force Fritzlein to take a less desirable position?
on Mar 10th, 2010, 6:59pm, aaaa wrote:Principal variation from bot:
32g Hg3e rg4s rg3w rf3x Hh3w
32s db4e hc5e hd5s Re5w
33g Re2n Hg3e Hh3w rh4s
33s hd4s hd3w Db3n hc3w
34g dd6w Ee6w Rd2n Ed6e |
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I don't like the idea of advancing the silver rabbit. If we need to take the rh4, will we move it west and put our rabbit on h4? (Yes, this is a little longer...)
on Mar 11th, 2010, 6:13am, RonWeasley wrote:| An alternative 33g dd6n Ee6w Rd5e Dg6n leads to sharp play where I so far believe silver stops the goal threat and gold retains slight advantage. But I don't recommend inviting sharp positions against Fritzlein if we don't have to. |
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Would Fritlzein be able to work his horse over to our advanced dog?
on Mar 12th, 2010, 6:36am, RonWeasley wrote:If we take the g4 rabbit now, I'm no longer worried about 32s db4e hc5e hd5s Re5w, because gold can play
33g Dg6n Ee6s Ee5s Re2e
and in all lines I see gold getting the silver horse hostage, which would be winning on this board. A silver goal attack on the east can be stopped and retreating the horse gives up the silver dog. |
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Hannoskaj
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Re: Move 33
« Reply #2 on: Mar 26th, 2010, 5:28am » |
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From the time I had spent on that possibility on the former move, I liked best chessandgo's suggestion.
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RonWeasley
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Re: Move 33
« Reply #3 on: Mar 26th, 2010, 7:49am » |
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on Mar 26th, 2010, 4:22am, Nombril wrote:Ron, are you doing any trash talk in the moves? I saw something earlier about it. I wonder if we should tell Fritzlein that quad is correctly predicting his moves?
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That's a good suggestion. I haven't been doing a lot of trash talk, but telling him he's playing just like a bot, even a good one like quad, is sufficiently insulting. Previously I told him he had nothing to worry about when we took his cat. Before that I told him we were waterboarding his camel after we took it hostage.
I've looked at a few positions and like chessandgo's dd6w Ee6w Rd5e Ed6e best. The move I suggested before seems to give silver more play.
If mobsters like this currently popular move, we could voice vote it and get back some of our time reserve, which helps us more than it helps Fritz.
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Nombril
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Re: Move 33
« Reply #4 on: Mar 26th, 2010, 10:48am » |
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Thinking about possible responses to:
33g dd6w Ee6w Rd5e Ed6e
The silver horse does slow down additional gold rabbits from advancing up the center. Are we OK with the possibility of our e5 rabbit standing between our Elephant and Fritz's horse? Something along the lines of:
33s dc6e cb5ee hd4s
I'm not sure how to respond to this, maybe
34g Re2n Rd2e Re3n Re2n
or
34g Cc2n Rd2w Rh2n Re2e
Do folks think this or some other 34g would be OK for us?
I agree building some reserve would be good, but wouldn't mind hearing opinions about the above, and also thinking about going after the horse with:
33g Dg6n Ee6s Ee5s Re2e
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Hannoskaj
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Re: Move 33
« Reply #5 on: Mar 27th, 2010, 2:40am » |
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Quote:
The silver horse does slow down additional gold rabbits from advancing up the center. Are we OK with the possibility of our e5 rabbit standing between our Elephant and Fritz's horse? Something along the lines of:
33s dc6e cb5ee hd4s
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This looks like an excellent Silver defense indeed.
An aggressive and dangerous possible reply would be something like
34g Db3b5 Ca3b3 Re2e3
On 33g Dg6n Ee6s Ee5s Re2e, I'll just quote the latest talk we had on the former move:
Quote:
>> What do you have on
>> 33s rd5c5 Hd4d5 rc5c6x Dc4c5 ?
>> For example
>> 34g Ee4c4d4 dc5c4
>> 34s Cb5c5 Dc4b4 Hd5e6
>> is certainly playable, but does not look final.
On 34g, I propose continuing:
34g Ee4n hd5s Ee5w Rd2n
34s dc5s Rd3e hd4s ef5s
35g Ed5s hd3s Ed4s Re3e
35s ef4e Rf3n Rf4n eg4w
36g rf7s rf6x Dg7w Db3n Ca3e
and getting a hostage horse in similar lines.
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Manuel
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Re: Move 33
« Reply #6 on: Mar 29th, 2010, 6:10am » |
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on Mar 27th, 2010, 2:40am, Hannoskaj wrote:
This looks like an excellent Silver defense indeed.
An aggressive and dangerous possible reply would be something like
34g Db3b5 Ca3b3 Re2e3
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I would not really like
33g dd6w Ee6w Rd5e Ed6e
33s dc6e cb5ee hd4s
34g Db3b5 Ca3b3 Re2e3
34s hd3e Cb3e hc3e hb3n
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RonWeasley
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Re: Move 33
« Reply #7 on: Mar 29th, 2010, 8:25am » |
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on Mar 29th, 2010, 6:10am, Manuel wrote:
I would not really like
33g dd6w Ee6w Rd5e Ed6e
33s dc6e cb5ee hd4s
34g Db3b5 Ca3b3 Re2e3
34s hd3e Cb3e hc3e hb3n |
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In response, 35g dd6w Ee6w Re3n Re5n. Silver can defend and I think gold maintains a slight advantage but silver has counterplay around c3, which I really don't like either.
I worry about 34s dc4w Cb3e db4s ra4s.
Based on this and Hannoskaj's comments, I am now more in favor of the safer
33g Dg6n Ee6s Ee5s Re2e
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Nombril
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Re: Move 33
« Reply #8 on: Mar 29th, 2010, 11:40pm » |
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Assuming Fritzlein figures out the h can't escape, will he look for something better to do?
33g Dg6n Ee6s Ee5s Re2e
33s - flip our rabbit into trap with dd6
34g - start to hostage the horse (hd4s Ee4w Rd2e +1step)
34s - e pulls our H
It still seems to work in our favor, but thought I would ask if anyone saw some response for silver besides trying to run away.
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chessandgo
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Re: Move 33
« Reply #9 on: Mar 30th, 2010, 1:10am » |
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on Mar 26th, 2010, 10:48am, Nombril wrote:
33g dd6w Ee6w Rd5e Ed6e
33s dc6e cb5ee hd4s
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34g Re2n Rd2e Re3n Re2n, or any move that advances Rabbits and puts something on e4, looks great for us. The g-file is open, so we just need to shove a rabbit up, even if silver manages to block the center (by using many pieces). Silver has no plan (taking hold of c3 would be much too long), so we're in great shape.
33s dc6e cb5ee hd4e looks like a better defense (but silver not even has the "attack c3" plan, and we still have the "Rabbit up g-file" plan).
I don't even want to look at horse capture possibilities because we want to goal 
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| « Last Edit: Mar 30th, 2010, 1:11am by chessandgo » |
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Manuel
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Re: Move 33
« Reply #10 on: Mar 30th, 2010, 2:00am » |
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on Mar 30th, 2010, 1:10am, chessandgo wrote:
34g Re2n Rd2e Re3n Re2n, or any move that advances Rabbits and puts something on e4, looks great for us. The g-file is open, so we just need to shove a rabbit up, even if silver manages to block the center (by using many pieces). Silver has no plan (taking hold of c3 would be much too long), so we're in great shape.
33s dc6e cb5ee hd4e looks like a better defense (but silver not even has the "attack c3" plan, and we still have the "Rabbit up g-file" plan).
I don't even want to look at horse capture possibilities because we want to goal |
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After
33g dd6w Ee6w Rd5e Ed6e
33s dc6e cb5ee hd4s
34g Re2n Rd2e Re3n Re2n
34s cd5s Re5w Rd5w cd4n
I don't really see how this path helps us goaling.
I think we should go after the horse or continue killing the eastwing rabbits.
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Hannoskaj
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Re: Move 33
« Reply #11 on: Mar 30th, 2010, 4:12am » |
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on Mar 30th, 2010, 2:00am, Manuel wrote:
After
33g dd6w Ee6w Rd5e Ed6e
33s dc6e cb5ee hd4s
34g Re2n Rd2e Re3n Re2n
34s cd5s Re5w Rd5w cd4n
I don't really see how this path helps us goaling.
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I think chessandgo's idea is to play 35g Re3g5, with pressure from e4 rabbit and the threat 36g Dg6f6 Hg3g4 Rg5g7.
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RonWeasley
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Re: Move 33
« Reply #12 on: Mar 30th, 2010, 4:31am » |
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on Mar 30th, 2010, 1:10am, chessandgo wrote:
34g Re2n Rd2e Re3n Re2n, or any move that advances Rabbits and puts something on e4, looks great for us. The g-file is open, so we just need to shove a rabbit up, even if silver manages to block the center (by using many pieces). Silver has no plan (taking hold of c3 would be much too long), so we're in great shape.
33s dc6e cb5ee hd4e looks like a better defense (but silver not even has the "attack c3" plan, and we still have the "Rabbit up g-file" plan).
I don't even want to look at horse capture possibilities because we want to goal |
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I had the same worry as Nombril. If I understand, you see the following line:
33g dd6w Ee6w Rd5e Ed6e
33s cb5e cc5e hd4s dc6e
34g Re2n Rd2e Re3n Re2n
34s cd5s Re5w Rd5w cd4n
35g Re3e Rf3n Rf4e Rg4n
which looks strong to me. Is this right?
After 33s cb5e cc5e dc6e hd4e, what is gold's response? We want to keep the silver horse away from the g-file and hostaging the gold dog. 34g Hg3n Rh1w Rg1n Rg2n?
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RonWeasley
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Re: Move 33
« Reply #13 on: Mar 30th, 2010, 11:31am » |
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I think we can vote tomorrow. Final arguments, please. Our contenders are:
1) 33g dd6w Ee6w Rd5e Ed6e and
2) 33g Dg6n Ee6s Ee5s Re2e
Given the latest guidance by C&G about following 1) with rabbits up the g-file, I'm leaning slightly toward that one, but I think we're winning with the other one too.
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Nombril
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Re: Move 33
« Reply #14 on: Mar 30th, 2010, 5:47pm » |
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on Mar 30th, 2010, 1:10am, chessandgo wrote:| I don't even want to look at horse capture possibilities because we want to goal |
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I totally agree - if we are confident it won't fizzle out. I had been focused on the center and thought that could be blocked - but missed that would leave the g-file vulnerable. I don't see a way for Fritzlein to stop goal in both spots, so I am much more confident about pressing forward with the goal attack.
For
33g dd6w Ee6w Rd5e Ed6e
33s cb5e cc5e hd4e dc6e
Ron's
34g Hg3n Rh1w Rg1n Rg2n
looks good to me.
If you are putting it to a voice vote,
+1 for 33g dd6w Ee6w Rd5e Ed6e
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