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Topic: 2012 Havannah Challenge Match (Read 17866 times) |
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omar
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2012 Havannah Challenge Match
« on: Mar 30th, 2012, 11:44am » |
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Christian, I had some questions relating to how the challenge match should be handled.
1. If there are more than one program that want to challenge you, should there be some tournament between the programs to see which one will be allowed to challenge you? Or were you planning to play 10 games against each of them. Or perhaps, once you've defeated a program then any challenger has to also defeat the program you most recently defeated before challenging you.
2. During the challenge match is the programmer allowed to make any changes to the program between games.
3. During challenge match games, can the programmer operate the program or must it be operated by an independent referee.
That's it for now.
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| « Last Edit: Apr 3rd, 2012, 7:38am by omar » |
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christianF
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Re: 2012 Havannah Challenge Match
« Reply #1 on: Apr 1st, 2012, 6:19am » |
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on Mar 30th, 2012, 11:44am, omar wrote:Christian, I had some questions relating to how the challenge match should be handled.
1. If there are more than one program that want to challenge you, should there be some tournament between the programs to see which one will be allowed to challenge you? Or were you planning to play 10 games against each of them. Or perhaps, once you've defeated a program then any challenger has to also defeat the program you most recently defeated before challenging you. |
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I play ten games total, and I don't care which bot(s) as long as I know 'who' I'm playing against. I've also insisted to play against every participating bot a couple of times in the weeks before to the contest. Castro is not Wanderer, and the Germans either pulled out or they may be preparing their secret weapon, I don't know.
on Mar 30th, 2012, 11:44am, omar wrote:
2. During the challenge match is the programmer allowed to make any chances to the program between games.
3. During challenge match games, can the programmer operate the program or must it be operated by an independent referee.
That's it for now.
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No fiddling during a game, but in between games is ok by me, plus a credible guarantee that I'm indeed playing against the bot.
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omar
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Re: 2012 Havannah Challenge Match
« Reply #2 on: Apr 2nd, 2012, 2:35pm » |
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Thanks, and what did you have in mind for the time controls?
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christianF
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Re: 2012 Havannah Challenge Match
« Reply #3 on: Apr 2nd, 2012, 3:02pm » |
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on Apr 2nd, 2012, 2:35pm, omar wrote:| Thanks, and what did you have in mind for the time controls? |
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Something like an hour per side and maybe 30 sec plus per move would suit me. Albert Vasse of DGT is also involved (they're based in Enschede where I live) so anything goes.
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omar
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Re: 2012 Havannah Challenge Match
« Reply #4 on: Apr 3rd, 2012, 8:27am » |
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Tony would like to know whether a program bug which makes the program need a restart, automatically means disqualification. Or can the programmer intervene and restart the program.
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christianF
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Re: 2012 Havannah Challenge Match
« Reply #5 on: Apr 3rd, 2012, 9:30am » |
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on Apr 3rd, 2012, 8:27am, omar wrote:| Tony would like to know whether a program bug which makes the program need a restart, automatically means disqualification. Or can the programmer intervene and restart the program. |
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Depends on the bug. If it causes a bad move I don't care. If there's a system crash I think it's fair to have it fixed in its own time, not in mine 
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omar
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Re: 2012 Havannah Challenge Match
« Reply #6 on: Apr 4th, 2012, 10:47am » |
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on Apr 3rd, 2012, 9:30am, christianF wrote:
Depends on the bug. If it causes a bad move I don't care. If there's a system crash I think it's fair to have it fixed in its own time, not in mine
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Well maybe if the program was restarted again it might pick a different move and continue the game, but if it continues to pick a bad move or continues to crash then after a few tries the only alternative would be for the developer to try and fix the code during the game. Are you saying that you are OK with the developer fixing the bug during the game as long as the bots clock is counting down?
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christianF
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Re: 2012 Havannah Challenge Match
« Reply #7 on: Apr 4th, 2012, 2:18pm » |
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on Apr 4th, 2012, 10:47am, omar wrote:
Well maybe if the program was restarted again it might pick a different move and continue the game, but if it continues to pick a bad move ... |
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If it moves that move counts, so how would we know a move was 'different' 
on Apr 4th, 2012, 10:47am, omar wrote:... or continues to crash then after a few tries the only alternative would be for the developer to try and fix the code during the game. Are you saying that you are OK with the developer fixing the bug during the game as long as the bots clock is counting down?
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That might be problematic. Does a clock continue if the program crashes? I'm no expert. I wouldn't mind if any technical problems were solved while the game pauses, if it doesn't upset things to a degree that might have a negative impact on concentration. I don't have much of an "off/on" switch when it comes to playing. I prepare mentally for one game, the next one, and that's about how far my powers of concentration will go. I dislike distractions or interruptions during a game. In case of a serious computer crash, a game might as well be postponed till the next day, as far as I'm concerned.
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Katsunami
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Re: 2012 Havannah Challenge Match
« Reply #9 on: Apr 28th, 2012, 10:40am » |
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Sorry to bust in, but is this "Havanna Challenge" for Go bots?
The game you linked looks like Go on a honeycomb shaped board; is it that, or is it actually something else with different rules? I've been searching a bit, but there seem to be many games that are called "Havanna", "Havanah", or similar, with different rules, and sometimes they're completely different games.
Ah, found it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Havannah
Developed by yourself I see. Nice. I'll Go ( ) and read the rules.
(It's a bit off-topic, but I find it baffling that whenever there is something to be developed or something to be done in the open source world, that there are always many more Dutch people in it than can be expected from the size of the population.)
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| « Last Edit: Apr 28th, 2012, 10:51am by Katsunami » |
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christianF
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Re: 2012 Havannah Challenge Match
« Reply #10 on: Apr 28th, 2012, 11:01am » |
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on Apr 28th, 2012, 10:40am, Katsunami wrote:| Sorry to bust in, but is this "Havanna Challenge" for Go bots? |
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Not quite. I'm playing ten games this summer, against the 4 or 5 top bots, and must win all to win a challenge put out in 2002.
on Apr 28th, 2012, 10:40am, Katsunami wrote:Ah, found it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Havannah
Developed by yourself I see. Nice. I'll Go () and read the rules.
(It's a bit off-topic, but I find it baffling that whenever there is something to be developed or something to be done in the open source world, that there are always many more Dutch people in it than can be expected from the size of the population.) |
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Most Havannah info can be found at mindsports, best place to play is Little Golem.
Regarding a bot contests, very shortly now the 2013 CodeCup Challenge will be announced and the game to program will be Symple, in case you'd like to compete
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christianF
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Re: 2012 Havannah Challenge Match
« Reply #11 on: Aug 8th, 2012, 7:54am » |
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Here's an update on the Challenge, at Google+
Also, the CodeCup Challenge 2013 has started with Symple as the piece de resistance.
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| « Last Edit: Aug 8th, 2012, 7:58am by christianF » |
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Fritzlein
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Re: 2012 Havannah Challenge Match
« Reply #12 on: Aug 8th, 2012, 11:54am » |
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Is there a way to link to completed games as they finish (assuming the games are preserved for posterity)? I'm rooting for you 100%. Go carbon-based life forms!
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| « Last Edit: Aug 8th, 2012, 11:55am by Fritzlein » |
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christianF
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Re: 2012 Havannah Challenge Match
« Reply #13 on: Aug 8th, 2012, 12:16pm » |
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on Aug 8th, 2012, 11:54am, Fritzlein wrote:| Is there a way to link to completed games as they finish (assuming the games are preserved for posterity)? I'm rooting for you 100%. Go carbon-based life forms! |
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Yes, the games will be played at iGGC and there will be a video livestream, and a YouTube summary after the event. Thanks for your support, I'll try to be a good carbon-based representative.
Actually I got an agenda too: don't trust 'intelligent systems' to make critical decisions (markets, military and the like) if they can't win a pencil & paper game. Amplifying the calculation speed of questionable algorithms doesn't make them any more 'intelligent', just faster 
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christianF
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Re: 2012 Havannah Challenge Match
« Reply #14 on: Oct 2nd, 2012, 9:49am » |
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Here's the press release.
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