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Topic: Google AI Contest Galactic Conquest (Read 22547 times) |
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Nombril
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Re: Google AI Contest Galactic Conquest
« Reply #120 on: Sep 19th, 2010, 9:57pm » |
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OK! I thought I had read discussions about "redirecting" ships. But maybe this was referring to an intended destination for a build up of ships that hadn't been actually sent yet.
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Hippo
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Re: Google AI Contest Galactic Conquest
« Reply #121 on: Sep 20th, 2010, 1:13am » |
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on Sep 19th, 2010, 6:23pm, Hippo wrote:
Oh yes in that case it's even better ... you lose nothing by going through 48. And you gain flexibility.
Even more, I would continue with flow through 48 to 14 (amount to win the fight) ... and according to the game state to the opposite 14 (may be through the planet mentioned earlier).
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I have changed my mind. Send 49+15 to 48 on first turn and wait for opponent's move. Centralize ships later ...
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Hippo
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Re: Google AI Contest Galactic Conquest
« Reply #122 on: Sep 20th, 2010, 2:48am » |
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on Sep 18th, 2010, 7:19pm, Hippo wrote:After several hours of calculations I came to easy deterministic strategy for fast capture for the case two lonely planets:
Let growth rate of both planets is G, tehir distance D, stronger player has S ships while weaker player has W ships.
Stronger player sends ships in bunches of DG+S-W
until the number of ships in the air is higher than W+(D+k)*G on turn k. At that time the flow of ships is stopped.
Weaker player has choice to send remaining ships immediately, but in that case he loses 2*G times the differnece between home exchanges. The other possibility is to left so many ships that home is defended even on turn (k+D-1). But in that case only DG defender ships would remain at turn k+D so attacking player could send all ships back without fear of losing the conquered planet. |
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Actually for deterministic case DG+S-W is good for flight 0, and if the number of ships in air does not exceed the limit, next flight could have 2G more ships, as in exchange home scenario attacker gains defender's planet one day earlier.
K-th flight could have 2kG more ships ...
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Hippo
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Re: Google AI Contest Galactic Conquest
« Reply #123 on: Sep 20th, 2010, 1:23pm » |
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I have looked at the starter pack. All example bots are started at each turn again. The bots cannot remember game state from one turn to another?
So even when bot makes long term plan, it has to reinvent it next turn again?
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Janzert
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Re: Google AI Contest Galactic Conquest
« Reply #124 on: Sep 20th, 2010, 1:42pm » |
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Bots run for the full length of the game, although it's a little easy to get confused on this by looking at the starter bots.
All bots are started once at the beginning of the game. Every turn they are resent the entire game state. The starter bots throw away all their state and regenerate it every turn. There isn't any reason you can't incrementally update your state each turn if you want.
Janzert
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jdb
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Re: Google AI Contest Galactic Conquest
« Reply #125 on: Sep 20th, 2010, 8:17pm » |
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Several people have mentioned the importance of centralizing troops.
Define the "radius" of a planet to be the number of turns to reach the farthest planet.
So the formuia for neutral planets can now be a function of distance, growth rate, troops required and radius.
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Hippo
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Re: Google AI Contest Galactic Conquest
« Reply #126 on: Sep 21st, 2010, 1:35am » |
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on Sep 20th, 2010, 8:17pm, jdb wrote:Several people have mentioned the importance of centralizing troops.
Define the "radius" of a planet to be the number of turns to reach the farthest planet.
So the formuia for neutral planets can now be a function of distance, growth rate, troops required and radius.
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I am not sure with that, but "border" planets are good only for production, but not for fight ... their ships should be sent back immediately ... Other situation is when there is another neutral nearby which could be occupied in near future ... in that case ships could be valuable here ...
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jdb
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Re: Google AI Contest Galactic Conquest
« Reply #127 on: Sep 28th, 2010, 10:22pm » |
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I have fixed, or at least have an idea on how to fix the obvious tactical mistakes. It requires some lookahead, but still fits under a tenth of a second.
What are some viable strategies assuming short term tactics are handled?
I tried always centralizing extra ships. Unfortunately this runs into trouble if there is a largish neutral planet towards the edge of the board.
Not centralizing extra ships runs into trouble when the opponent gets too many ships in the centre. So it seems something more dynamic is needed to handle troop relocation.
Another attempt was to only attack the enemy when you have a decisive advantage, equal or greater growth and 50 extra ships. It also seems wise to attack if behind on growth. This idea tested pretty well.
All of the maps are symmetrical. I wonder if simply colonizing the planets on the home half of the board and defending them is enough. It is relatively easy to defend against an equal strength attacker. There are cases where it is necessary to keep enough troops close to a planet on the enemy half of the board, so he can't take it. This method runs into trouble if the enemy takes a central planet and starts loading it up with troops.
Anyone have any other ideas to try out?
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Hippo
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Re: Google AI Contest Galactic Conquest
« Reply #128 on: Sep 29th, 2010, 4:19pm » |
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I have start implementing my own bot ... It appeared much more complicated than I expected  . I am not sure if the bot would even became competitive.
There are some points in the current rules what should one have in mind. I am not sure someone have demonstarted it already:
Any player could start playing "fog" game. Sending enough 0 size fleets one can limit players not to have time to read entire input. Unprepared player loses on time. Better player is paralyzed. Correctly implemented player shoud switch to the fog mode, when only planets are read from input and fleets are just extrapolated.
Playing against paralyzed player have an advantage that reading planets is enough to know he is paralyzed.
I am far away from implementing competitive bot and from implementing competitive fog mode even further.
jdb@ yes, centralizing/attacking further neutral is difficult decision.
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| « Last Edit: Sep 29th, 2010, 4:23pm by Hippo » |
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jdb
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Re: Google AI Contest Galactic Conquest
« Reply #129 on: Sep 29th, 2010, 6:44pm » |
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on Sep 29th, 2010, 4:19pm, Hippo wrote:I have start implementing my own bot ... It appeared much more complicated than I expected . I am not sure if the bot would even became competitive.
There are some points in the current rules what should one have in mind. I am not sure someone have demonstarted it already:
Any player could start playing "fog" game. Sending enough 0 size fleets one can limit players not to have time to read entire input. Unprepared player loses on time. Better player is paralyzed. Correctly implemented player shoud switch to the fog mode, when only planets are read from input and fleets are just extrapolated.
Playing against paralyzed player have an advantage that reading planets is enough to know he is paralyzed.
I am far away from implementing competitive bot and from implementing competitive fog mode even further.
jdb@ yes, centralizing/attacking further neutral is difficult decision. |
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It is my understanding that fleets of zero size are no longer allowed. Fleets of size 1 are allowed.
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Hippo
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Re: Google AI Contest Galactic Conquest
« Reply #130 on: Sep 30th, 2010, 1:31am » |
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on Sep 29th, 2010, 6:44pm, jdb wrote:
It is my understanding that fleets of zero size are no longer allowed. Fleets of size 1 are allowed. |
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That is improvement. Making fog from 1 size fleets is much more compllicated may be impossible at all.
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Hippo
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Re: Google AI Contest Galactic Conquest
« Reply #131 on: Oct 2nd, 2010, 9:07am » |
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Hmm, my current version of bot does not play well, but I suppose it could be in first fifth of the participants.
(Attacking exposed enemy planets implemented, trying not to expose itself and centralizing implemented. It is not good code and there is a lot of things on to do list, but it would be better to concentrate on other things.)
It may be fun to let it fight with others ... so I will probably post it as it is. ... sending not last, but almost stable version.
(http://ai-contest.com/profile.php?user_id=10369)
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| « Last Edit: Oct 2nd, 2010, 1:29pm by Hippo » |
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jdb
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Re: http://ai-contest.com/visualizer.php?game_id=5
« Reply #134 on: Oct 6th, 2010, 8:54pm » |
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on Oct 3rd, 2010, 4:11am, Hippo wrote:
Against better bot's it would be much more important to hold exposed planets.
http://ai-contest.com/visualizer.php?game_id=5342208
Twice the same problem in calculating sufficient number of ships ... I know that I wrote about it to jdb, but it is not implemented yet.
Planning on this map could be helpful 
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I've seen this happen with my bot too. For example, in the game in question, red sends troops to colonize the 24 planet in the lower left. Blue sends a snipe attempt, which red correctly defends. The problem occurs because blue colonized the 23 planet. It is far closer to the 24 planet than red's available defence. The future simulation needs to take this into account. Red needs to send defence in response to a future enemy planet. The calculation is still doable in a fraction of a second.
Interestingly, when I added this to my bot, it made it play worse. It became too timid, worrying about potential attacks that never happened.
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