Welcome, Guest. Please Login or Register.
Dec 8th, 2019, 2:37pm

Home Home Help Help Search Search Members Members Login Login Register Register
Arimaa Forum « Game viewer / analysis tool »


   Arimaa Forum
   Arimaa
   Site Discussion
(Moderator: supersamu)
   Game viewer / analysis tool
« Previous topic | Next topic »
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5  ...  10 Reply Reply Notify of replies Notify of replies Send Topic Send Topic Print Print
   Author  Topic: Game viewer / analysis tool  (Read 47011 times)
clojure
Forum Guru
*****



Arimaa player #5004

   
WWW

Gender: male
Posts: 207
Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #30 on: Sep 13th, 2010, 2:26pm »
Quote Quote Modify Modify

on Sep 13th, 2010, 2:19pm, Hippo wrote:

There is background.html. When I click it, I got somewhere I am not familiar with ... should I do there something?

 
No, that's meant for developers. But it sounds there's some weird problem with recognizing that the current page is ok. One thing could be that for some reason the call for checking if it's Arimaa.com and if there's list of moves is made before the page dom (structure) is created in browser.
 
:<
 
Quote:
And rabbits are shown only on the board ...

Funny. That. Maybe they want to play hide and seek.
 
Umm. there's always chance I screwed up the distribution... but I'll wait a bit if someone else wants to have a go.
« Last Edit: Sep 13th, 2010, 6:58pm by clojure » IP Logged
clojure
Forum Guru
*****



Arimaa player #5004

   
WWW

Gender: male
Posts: 207
Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #31 on: Sep 13th, 2010, 3:15pm »
Quote Quote Modify Modify

I just tried with Ubuntu and Chromium and your currently ongoing game works fine with above instructions. Do you go to the game via game room and use the default client? I forgot that there even existed others... this extension will not support them probably (without looking).
 
edit: If anyone is interested in developing a Chrome extension (was it related to Arimaa or not), you might want to read how I felt about it (If you feel this is not relevant, please say and I will remove it)
« Last Edit: Sep 13th, 2010, 5:30pm by clojure » IP Logged
Hippo
Forum Guru
*****




Arimaa player #4450

   


Gender: male
Posts: 881
Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #32 on: Sep 13th, 2010, 7:16pm »
Quote Quote Modify Modify

I am using javascript client.
IP Logged

Fritzlein
Forum Guru
*****



Arimaa player #706

   
Email

Gender: male
Posts: 5928
Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #33 on: Sep 15th, 2010, 1:36am »
Quote Quote Modify Modify

I also tried using the Chrome extension, but like Hippo, I get no rabbit to click, although every step of the instructions seemed to work.  I'm using Windows 7 and Chrome 6.0.472.55.
IP Logged

clojure
Forum Guru
*****



Arimaa player #5004

   
WWW

Gender: male
Posts: 207
Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #34 on: Sep 15th, 2010, 3:00am »
Quote Quote Modify Modify

Thanks for reporting. So far, one has told me that it worked (beside me). Though, there's a weird thing: first time the rabbit is clicked, the moves are not imported. But after that it seems to work.
 
I'm withholding the development of Chrome extension until I get a bit more done with the viewer.
 
Last night I designed the new format. http://bitbucket.org/egaga/arimaa-game-viewer/wiki/doc_flexible_format
 
I implemented the support for exporting moves but not with other data yet. Also no importing for that.
IP Logged
clojure
Forum Guru
*****



Arimaa player #5004

   
WWW

Gender: male
Posts: 207
Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #35 on: Sep 15th, 2010, 11:59am »
Quote Quote Modify Modify

Ok, so for first time the bunny icon didn't show up for me either Huh but after a second I realized that Chrome had been updated a day ago (I noticed this since http is not showing up anymore.)
 
There must have been some change to API or behavior. I really didn't think that versions would matter that much in this case. Roll Eyes
« Last Edit: Sep 15th, 2010, 12:01pm by clojure » IP Logged
omar
Forum Guru
*****



Arimaa player #2

   


Gender: male
Posts: 976
Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #36 on: Sep 16th, 2010, 5:29am »
Quote Quote Modify Modify

Great work Henrik. I haven't downloaded and tried out the viewer yet, but I'll do that soon.
 
This should now be working:
  http://arimaa.com/arimaa/games/agn.cgi  
so you can download game data using this. It broke when I transfered the site to a new server due to some missing modules.
 
For getting a players' game ids you could probably use this:
  http://arimaa.com/arimaa/gameroom/playerRatingHist.cgi
 
http://socket.io looks like a good solution for the client to establish a persistent socket connection.
 
http://nodejs.org looks like a good solution for the server side. But I've never used JavaScript on the server side so I don't know if it has libraries for accessing a MySQL database.
 
Of course we need to experiment with both of these a bit to see how stable they are and what problems could arise.
 
The current JavaScript client was designed so that it can be dropped into a web page using a SCRIPT tag and then controlled programmatically using methods that it provides. It also provides it's own buttons, but those could be programatically hidden if needed and the button clicks could be simulated via methods such as eventUndoMove() by the external controller. The intent was that the JavaScript client could be used for annotating games in a manner similar to this:
  http://chessbase.com/news/2010/games/simpsons01.htm
 
Notice how you can click on moves in the comments to go to the corresponding positions. Even proposed moves can be clicked on to view the variations.
 
I never got around to writing some of the methods for changing the move list and documenting the methods well enough so that other could start using it, but the intent was good Smiley
 
If you use a similar design for your game viewer so that it can be pulled into a page using a SCRIPT tag and then controlled via methods it provides, then it can be extended and used in many ways; provided that you expose the methods and document them Smiley
 
IP Logged
clojure
Forum Guru
*****



Arimaa player #5004

   
WWW

Gender: male
Posts: 207
Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #37 on: Sep 16th, 2010, 9:28am »
Quote Quote Modify Modify

on Sep 16th, 2010, 5:29am, omar wrote:
Great work Henrik. I haven't downloaded and tried out the viewer yet, but I'll do that soon.

 
Thank you Smiley
 
I'll look the data retrieving urls soon. It's good to have them!
 
Quote:

http://nodejs.org looks like a good solution for the server side. But I've never used JavaScript on the server side so I don't know if it has libraries for accessing a MySQL database.

 
I haven't really taken a good look what kind of libraries it has but I think it had at least API for Postgres. I'm quite sure that also for MySQL but I must ask (as NOT database expert) that why MySQL instead of PostgreSQL. My understanding is that experts don't take MySQL seriously because of some technical  solutions.
 
Even if node.js didn't provide a way to access any kind of persistent data saving (which is not the case), it can still used for prototyping and works great for teaching sessions. The game with comments / annotations etc can be saved by having another, stupid connection to server side process that just saves any given FAN (http://bitbucket.org/egaga/arimaa-game-viewer/wiki/doc_flexible_format).
 
Quote:

The intent was that the JavaScript client could be used for annotating games in a manner similar to this:
  http://chessbase.com/news/2010/games/simpsons01.htm
 
If you use a similar design for your game viewer so that it can be pulled into a page using a SCRIPT tag and then controlled via methods it provides, then it can be extended and used in many ways; provided that you expose the methods and document them Smiley

 
This is nice. I have done similar thing a few months ago with embedding a Factor programming language interpreter to a web page tutorial. http://personal.inet.fi/koti/egaga/jsfactor/tutorial.html
 
People that would write tutorial page only needed to insert code into html element with class "codeblock" and the interpreter would give result which automatically creates a visual representation. Also readers of the page can insert arbitrary code and get results.
 
A bit more API was needed to do the actual playground for the language:
http://personal.inet.fi/koti/egaga/jsfactor/playground.html
 
Documenting a small API is no problem. I also intend to document the overall architecture later. Now I have mostly documented things that users find interesting. Thus I don't encourage people to dive into the code yet, as it is of production quality only in some of the components.
« Last Edit: Sep 16th, 2010, 9:32am by clojure » IP Logged
clojure
Forum Guru
*****



Arimaa player #5004

   
WWW

Gender: male
Posts: 207
Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #38 on: Sep 16th, 2010, 10:18am »
Quote Quote Modify Modify

To make it easier to try out current version, I put it online: http://personal.inet.fi/koti/egaga/arimaa/arimaa.html
 
Worked with Opera, Chrome, Safari, Firefox (also in Linux, Ubuntu) but had animation weirdness in Chromium (Ubuntu).
 
edit: Here is list of node.js modules which seems to have a mysql protocol implementations (dunno about the quality / state of progress of those) http://github.com/ry/node/wiki/modules
« Last Edit: Sep 16th, 2010, 11:10am by clojure » IP Logged
megajester
Forum Guru
*****




Istanbul, Turkey

   
Email

Gender: male
Posts: 710
Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #39 on: Sep 16th, 2010, 2:53pm »
Quote Quote Modify Modify

on Sep 16th, 2010, 10:18am, clojure wrote:
To make it easier to try out current version, I put it online: http://personal.inet.fi/koti/egaga/arimaa/arimaa.html
 
Worked with Opera, Chrome, Safari, Firefox (also in Linux, Ubuntu) but had animation weirdness in Chromium (Ubuntu).
 
edit: Here is list of node.js modules which seems to have a mysql protocol implementations (dunno about the quality / state of progress of those) http://github.com/ry/node/wiki/modules

Man this is so cool. If we had a way of integrating something like this into the gameroom it would open up all sorts of possibities, like one-on-one coaching sessions etc...
 
Would it be possible to add a Facebook-style chat bar to the bottom like I've seen on some websites?...
 
This is just me speculating, please feel free to ignore me and get on with more urgent stuff...
IP Logged

clojure
Forum Guru
*****



Arimaa player #5004

   
WWW

Gender: male
Posts: 207
Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #40 on: Sep 16th, 2010, 3:07pm »
Quote Quote Modify Modify

Hey megajester, thanks for the feedback. I hope anyone is not holding his thoughts.
 
The wiki has plans what's to come, in particular this might interest you: http://bitbucket.org/egaga/arimaa-game-viewer/wiki/doc_shared_board
 
But as Fritzlein was eager to remind, one should first focus on the offline-viewer. That alone would be useful, if people share their desktop via ssh or Skype.
 
The chat would be the easiest to add of what there's to come but then I would need to put up server or integrate with Omar. If you look the issues I have in http://bitbucket.org/egaga/arimaa-game-viewer/issues?status=new&stat us=open you might get understanding what I probably do before the chat.
 
Though, one can always have a small hope Tongue
 
But anywys, suggestions are welcome. New ones will be added to candidate feature list.
« Last Edit: Sep 16th, 2010, 3:08pm by clojure » IP Logged
Nombril
Forum Guru
*****



Arimaa player #4509

   
Email

Gender: male
Posts: 292
Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #41 on: Sep 16th, 2010, 4:09pm »
Quote Quote Modify Modify

I've been following the discussion, and finally took a look with the online version you just published.  Thanks for making it so easy to try out.  I too think this will be a great tool.
 
If you get to live collaborative analyzing, it might be worth having timestamp/username in the comment field, as with the chat program.  Maybe have a section for "live comments" and a second section for comments added by the players or others after the game.  (You currently have Position and Move comments - just change the labels?)
 
I do see the value in having the colored squares A, B, C, when discussing the importance of a particular square in an ongoing/multi move trap control battle (or other "longer" range struggles).
 
As a minor point, I wonder if anyone else misses sound affects for the piece movement?  (I was very annoyed by some sounds when I first started on arimaa.com, but now it strikes me as 'broken' when sound isn't there.)
IP Logged

clojure
Forum Guru
*****



Arimaa player #5004

   
WWW

Gender: male
Posts: 207
Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #42 on: Sep 16th, 2010, 4:18pm »
Quote Quote Modify Modify

on Sep 16th, 2010, 4:09pm, Nombril wrote:
I've been following the discussion, and finally took a look with the online version you just published.

 
Yeah, I figured that might get some new people to try it out. Smiley
 
About comments, currently I'm thinking that there will be separate comments and chat. But I think I need also distinction of move/position comments, since they work functionally differently. (Position comments show's in all variations but move comments are different for each move/variation)
 
About markers, if anyone come up any other kind of information that could be tied to the position, other than textual comment/coordinate color, feel free to say. Different shapes are for example a possibility.
 
Quote:

As a minor point, I wonder if anyone else misses sound affects for the piece movement?

 
This is valuable information. I'll add a task, so that people have the option to have sounds if they have modern browser that supports HTML5 (I think ogg format is supported).
 
So thanks for testing!
IP Logged
omar
Forum Guru
*****



Arimaa player #2

   


Gender: male
Posts: 976
Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #43 on: Sep 16th, 2010, 9:34pm »
Quote Quote Modify Modify

Quote:

I haven't really taken a good look what kind of libraries it has but I think it had at least API for Postgres. I'm quite sure that also for MySQL but I must ask (as NOT database expert) that why MySQL instead of PostgreSQL. My understanding is that experts don't take MySQL seriously because of some technical  solutions.

 
I'm no database expert either. It just happened that back when I was selecting a DB for the Arimaa site I heard that MySQL was very fast although it didn't have the high-end features like transactions, stored procedures, etc. I figured I probably don't need these and started using MySQL. But it sounds like over the years MySQL added more features and PostgresSQL has become faster.
 
http://www.wikivs.com/wiki/MySQL_vs_PostgreSQL
 
I guess for me to change the DB for the current site would require a lot of code changes and wouldn't be worthwhile, but if rebuilding from scratch the choice of what database to use is open and should be reevaluated.
IP Logged
omar
Forum Guru
*****



Arimaa player #2

   


Gender: male
Posts: 976
Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #44 on: Sep 16th, 2010, 10:05pm »
Quote Quote Modify Modify

I just tried out the game viewer and took a look at your code. I am quite amazed at what you've done already and consider it still pre beta. The JavaScript client we use in the gameroom is about 4300 lines of code and doesn't use any libraries. Your code is using jQuery libraries and is already about 2600 lines. It is coming along very fast.
IP Logged
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5  ...  10 Reply Reply Notify of replies Notify of replies Send Topic Send Topic Print Print

« Previous topic | Next topic »

Arimaa Forum » Powered by YaBB 1 Gold - SP 1.3.1!
YaBB © 2000-2003. All Rights Reserved.