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Topic: Game viewer / analysis tool (Read 63131 times) |
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clojure
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Arimaa player #5004
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Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #45 on: Sep 16th, 2010, 10:16pm » |
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Thanks for the info on database. I'm mostly worried about transactions and sane behavior but maybe it's not crucial in Arimaa context.
I just committed initial version for the functionality of importing the new notation but it's not usable for user. I created a pretty controversial way to traverse the notation for creating abstract tree of moves but it helped to make it a bit more declarative looking. I've thought about giving CoffeeScript a try since it would help to make code somewhat cleaner (it's compiles quite directly to Javascript). The only problem could be debugging, even though the compiler should spit nice looking code. But probably I wont' use it for this project. Here's a link for those that are interested http://jashkenas.github.com/coffee-script/
What comes to the amount of code lines, I have not been up to my standards. It will be compacted and made beautiful. But my main concern is to keep code high-level and quite straightforward so that people would understand it. So far, I've tried mostly only to have natural component division. Global entanglement of implementation details would be suicide.
Luckily, I've overcome my fears of showing code, even though I know it can give poor impression. Nowadays for this kind of project I have different priorities. So getting features fast enough is important, so that my interest won't derail to other things.
So far, it's been fun, and surprisingly making the wiki look tidy and valuable has been more of a enjoyment than labour.
Keep giving feedback and I will deliver! 
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| « Last Edit: Sep 16th, 2010, 10:24pm by clojure » |
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clojure
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Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #46 on: Sep 17th, 2010, 2:59pm » |
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Sometimes I feel like I'm spamming considering the throughput of this site (have I started a mad race for 5000th post with Fritzlein? I want a bunny cake, too!).
The following url will work as a partial filter: http://bitbucket.org/egaga/arimaa-game-viewer/wiki/documentation_develop ment_diary
I will write there daily what I've done as the progress goes on. You get a glimpse of struggles overcome. The content could be a bit raw for non-programmers but some of you might find it still interesting enough to have a look at it.
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| « Last Edit: Sep 17th, 2010, 3:00pm by clojure » |
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clojure
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Arimaa player #5004
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Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #47 on: Sep 23rd, 2010, 1:03am » |
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I feel that the current site has a bit too big initial barrier to try out the game since it requires registration and firing up a game is after so many clicks (these things matter, unfortunately).
So here's what I did this morning:
http://personal.inet.fi/koti/egaga/arimaa-begin/tutorial.html
I would appreciate somebody with artistic talent could help me out...
The idea is that this could be used to lure people to try out Arimaa quickly. I intend to make a different page for interactive tutorial.
The bot is 1-ply-no-evaluation-function genius at the moment
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| « Last Edit: Sep 23rd, 2010, 1:44am by clojure » |
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omar
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Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #48 on: Sep 24th, 2010, 1:44am » |
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Wow, this is really neat. I can't believe how fast you made this. This tutorial will be a great way for new players to try out the game.
Noticed a rule checking bug. If I start a push by moving the opponents piece then I am able to move another of the opponents piece to complete the push. I should only be able to use one of my stronger pieces to complete the push.
The side panel to explain the rules is nice, but it might not be enough space. Maybe you might want to consider having a link for the rules which opens a separate window to explain the rules. I like how you used the piece icons to show examples of the rules.
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omar
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Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #49 on: Sep 24th, 2010, 1:47am » |
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I see that the new step sound file I gave also did not work well. I'm not sure why these aren't working well in fireFox.
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clojure
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Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #50 on: Sep 24th, 2010, 2:06am » |
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on Sep 24th, 2010, 1:44am, omar wrote:
Noticed a rule checking bug. If I start a push by moving the opponents piece then I am able to move another of the opponents piece to complete the push. I should only be able to use one of my stronger pieces to complete the push.
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Nice catch! I didn't test the rules exhaustively yet. Moreover, at least the repetition and immobilization ones haven't been added.
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The side panel to explain the rules is nice, but it might not be enough space. Maybe you might want to consider having a link for the rules which opens a separate window to explain the rules. I like how you used the piece icons to show examples of the rules.
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I hear what you're saying. For proper rules explanation, yeah, I have to add a separate page, or other mechanism, such as a div-hover-popup.
The sound file is not the new one, actually, since it would require a change of code, and wouldn't still work properly. It's a shame.
I'll try to add a bit of intelligent behavior to the bot so that it feels more helpful for beginners, and doesn't confuse with kamikazing 
I really appreciate the feedback, thanks.
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| « Last Edit: Sep 24th, 2010, 3:36am by clojure » |
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clojure
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Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #51 on: Sep 25th, 2010, 2:40pm » |
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Call for feedback! I'd like to know how you find the new user interface. Is it simple enough to understand without explanation? Is it smooth experience?
http://personal.inet.fi/koti/egaga/arimaa-begin/tutorial.html
There is also one debatable question: should the moves be animated after the whole move, or should they be animated for every step?
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rabbits
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Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #52 on: Sep 25th, 2010, 6:01pm » |
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It looks very nice!
I think the trap squares should be highlighted in some way when you can move to them.
The sound isn't working for me (Firefox).
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clojure
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Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #53 on: Sep 25th, 2010, 6:57pm » |
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Thanks! Yeah, I forgot the trap thing. Now it's highlighted but for the sake of structural visuals, it has different border color. And the sound thing is known for Firefox.
If somebody knows why Firefox reads ogg file differently from other browsers, and how to convert the original http://arimaa.com/arimaa/jsClient/pro/sounds/trap.mp3 or
the Audacity converted http://arimaa.com/arimaa/jsClient/pro/sounds/step2.mp3
so that it works with Firefox's html5 support. The best I could do was to convert the step2 but it had too much silence before and after the sound... and for some reason I couldn't get it to interrupt the playing as in other browsers.
(I wouldn't want to include external sound managers or flash.)
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| « Last Edit: Sep 25th, 2010, 6:58pm by clojure » |
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Nombril
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Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #54 on: Sep 26th, 2010, 3:35pm » |
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Hi, I took a quick look at the game page, and had a few suggestions.
Is it possible to show captured pieces?
I wasn't able to use it on an iPad/Safari. But this might not be a supported browser!
For the rules
* "Move piece(s) up to 4 times in one turn" might be more clear if you replace 'times' with 'steps'.
Setup:
* This might not be the best starting setup for beginners. Maybe dog, horse, cat, as the left three pieces? or 99of9 setup? Do you want to make a note that normally you get to set up your pieces in any order you choose? (I can understand that you aren't having a first time player do the setup, even though it is an important part of the game.)
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clojure
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Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #55 on: Sep 26th, 2010, 3:48pm » |
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Hi, you brought up good questions!
on Sep 26th, 2010, 3:35pm, Nombril wrote:
Is it possible to show captured pieces?
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Will be added. Also how many steps are left.
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I wasn't able to use it on an iPad/Safari. But this might not be a supported browser!
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Safari works for me in Windows Vista. Cannot test with iPad; I would gladly hear if someone else got it to work. Other browser support is of interest to me also but I don't expect it to work in IE since I haven't tried.
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* "Move piece(s) up to 4 times in one turn" might be more clear if you replace 'times' with 'steps'.
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Could be better. I'm not sure which one is more intuitive for a random guy. I'll change it somehow.
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This might not be the best starting setup for beginners. Maybe dog, horse, cat, as the left three pieces? or 99of9 setup?
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This is something I didn't think about much. As a beginner myself, I'm quite unaware how I should start and have felt that fuzzy setup with something like rabbits at back row and elephant in the middle is all I can thrive for. I'll change the startup setup now that someone more knowledgeable has spoken
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Do you want to make a note that normally you get to set up your pieces in any order you choose? (I can understand that you aren't having a first time player do the setup, even though it is an important part of the game.) |
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Well, this is a hard question. I would like to, but I also try to keep it limited to essentials of what might interest a beginner to goto Arimaa.com, and then he would immediately see that "ah, of course!". I would suspect that it's quite a low probability to get disinterested by that he cannot choose his own formation, since everything is new and taking his brain power to absorb. Maybe Kasparov or board game geek might notice it at his first time?
So it comes to the balance of information overload and how to keep layout in minimum so that it can be used with low-resolution monitors. There are other information that I'd like to add, such as the immobilization rule, since if it occurs in a beginner game, he will be totally confused. Especially, since I haven't added that rule yet to my engine
Thank you.
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| « Last Edit: Sep 26th, 2010, 3:50pm by clojure » |
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clojure
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Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #56 on: Sep 26th, 2010, 4:38pm » |
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I have done the changes. Please comment if it's better now.
Do forced refresh in your browser if it feels like it's broken or there is no difference. Ctrl+r in some browsers.
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Nombril
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Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #57 on: Sep 26th, 2010, 8:04pm » |
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I had a minute for a quick look. Flip silver (or gold) camel/elephant, so E is across from m and M across from e.
For the captured pieces, I am used to one row for each color, and having the pieces ordered by strength. Order of capture isn't too important. The icon can be smaller if required to fit well.
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clojure
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Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #58 on: Sep 27th, 2010, 6:38am » |
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Done. Except that even though I'd like to have the captures for each side on one line, making the images smaller is problematic. I even find that their size is too small as is.
One solution would be to put the captures on top and on below of the board, the silver pieces under gold home row, and vice versa. But it would be better to fully take advantage of the empty space on the right side -- again for support for low resolutions.
I might change it somehow, so I'm eager to hear more opinions.
edit: added possibility to remove rules. They will be back when page is refreshed.
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| « Last Edit: Sep 27th, 2010, 8:02am by clojure » |
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clojure
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Arimaa player #5004
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Re: Game viewer / analysis tool
« Reply #59 on: Sep 27th, 2010, 9:00am » |
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For slower machines, the viewer and tutorial has been updated so that it doesn't show shadows or border rounding anymore. I was informed that it had quite a big impact on the responsiveness. Now it should feel much slicker!
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